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Dr. Paul, welcome to with the wind science revealed. My guest today returning is Dr. H. Dr. Ely. He is the Executive Committee director of the Energetic Health Institute that he runs, teaches. And he is an incredible scientific researcher. What we're talking about today, in really great detail is water. Why it's so important, and what you can do to have the most healthful water that will absolutely transform your health journey. You're gonna find the DVD segment at the end of this entertaining as she just really gets personal with him. And then of course, she closes it out with her from the soul. Enjoy the show. Dr. Paul, coming to you from the heart. My topic for today is happiness and stress. I'm a student at the Energetic Health Institute. That is the program I'm taking the holistic nutrition program that Dr. Ely, you're going to hear from him later, he's my guest on the show today, has created and it's it's a master course is just incredible. So one of the segments had this interesting point. As you increase happiness, stress decreases. Think about that. It is hard to be stressed out when you're getting happy. So what makes you happy? Well, for me getting in touch with my purpose sure helps. Because if I'm lost about what my purpose is, it's very easy to have stress take over. So spend a little time get locked in with your purpose, why we're here on this earth. I've been blessed to have been put in the place that you all have heard my journey. And I live with purpose, thankfully did all the patients in my lives all the heartaches that have gone through so many families with vaccine injury, and you hear it all on the show. Purpose helps. But here's the thing, we want joy, we want happiness. And so how do we get that? Well, there's a trick, you can just give people compliments. It's very interesting to see what happens when you say, Oh, lovely shirt, I love your sweater, great earrings or whatever a little, you might think it's nothing. And it lights up people's eyes and they smile, they interact. Occasionally they don't interact at all. And you know, okay, well not interacting with that person. So the other side of this to be truly happy is you need laughter in your life, make opportunities for laughter. When I had that house full of kids, when I was raising all those kids, we had eight kids, most of them teenagers at one time in the house for an entire year before a couple of them moved on. And some of my kids had gone through horrendous things, losing their parents, we adopted them. Yet we had so much laughter in that house. There was happiness, there was joy, even this and despite some situations that you would go how do people even go on. So find ways to make laughter a part of your life. It's amazing what it does. And then just don't forget stress reduction, we need sleep, we need exercise, we need great nutrition. But when it gets really bad, it's been a while since I've reminded you breathe. Breathe in love. release stress. You do that a few cycles, and you will be amazed at how much better you feel. So in the end, we're gonna have happiness when we have connections. We want loving connections with people, people we care about. Let's go out and do that. And don't forget your connection to your higher power. Welcome, Dr. H. It is so great to have you back on the show with the wind. Oh my brother, man, it's so good to be here. And this wonderful new year that we have together as well. So much excitement so much to teach. And man, I just love everything that you're doing. And I'm so grateful for all the work that you've been doing, man, it's inspiring. You are doing folks, if you don't know this man is the Executive Committee director for Energetic Health Institute, which happens to be where I am taking your incredible course holistic nutrition. It starts off with a whole overview of holistic nutrition then yet you actually learned how to do raw and vegan, which is something I've never done either of those things. And this last segment I've just finished is called happiness and energetic meditation. Wow. And this is not your traditional standard, learn what calories are and this is in depth to your heart and soul. And man, you are a great educator. You're an incredible leader. Thank you for what you've put together in that course. Oh man, thank you for I wanted to thank you for the honor of Your presence in that course when I saw that You were coming in, I was just like what Dr. Ball was covered in the study, I was like, I hope we do a good job. But man, just that you're having such a great time with it, and you're learning so much. And I just have the utmost gratitude and respect for you. And I'm just truly grateful for those kind words. That means the world to me. Now the gratitude is to you have put together a masterpiece. That was us docs, we got almost zero training and nutrition period. And we also got very little education actually none in things like Energetic Health and love things that actually are powerful. That us we've in such a beautiful way. So folks, if you're watching and you've ever wanted to just whether it's to become an actual educator yourself, or just for your own journey, this the people Oh, the family that's together there at the Energetic Health Institute is amazing. We've covered water and food and supplements and restorative sleep, exercise the power of community and you always throw love in there. And so just incredible stuff. I thought, because it's a new year, what if I love your take on water? And how important it is? Could you maybe walk us through what you've stumbled on? And what you feel like would be the most important way for an individual, me the host of the show? Sure. But for you, the viewer, what should we be doing these days, and let's start with water. My goodness, Dr. Paul, I am so excited about water. And I was already a huge water nerd with Massaro. Emoto is where the secret messages and water the secret language of water and people writing words on their bottle of water and everything to infuse it with an energy and everything energy signature. I've been doing that for 25 years. But what we found was in the last year, I was working with Dr. Ed group who does a beautiful job with water at global healing.com I got to take a tour of his facility. And he was doing some things with water that I thought were just I really thought it was only conceptual I didn't think we had anybody who knew how to do production. So like Dr. Group was is he triple distills his water that what the tap water that comes in, and then plays music and Fibonacci sequences and runs it through structuring devices and crystals before that water is ready to become part of the medicines that he's making. And then he takes Karelian photography afterwards to show the energy signature of his products after they've been produced. And it's just this beautiful thing you can feel the energy of it. So I was talking with him last year because I was like we I think we have a problem here. We know you remember back to Flint, right? You remember back in Flint, Michigan and the water was polluted right that that never got resolved. And you see the big problem with all the plastic bottles nobody feels good about buying a plastic bottle anymore. And so it's what can we do about that? Is there something that we can do to make sure that the water coming out of someone's tap can be purified so that it is now impressionable with prayer and good intention and words and that it is when it's consumed does help cells communicate? See that's the power of masala motos work and Nobel laureate Luke monkstown, yeas work on water is what they're showing is that water does more than just act as a carrier medium for things that actually helps participate in cell communication, and optimizing how cells talk to each other. So it's going to bring that love and that happiness in. I started working on some stuff last year, last summer, after being inspired by Dr. Group, we were talking about it back and forth. And we put together a sequence I want to share right now we share this sequence that healing for the ages. If you haven't checked that conference out, you owe it to yourself to go into healing for the ages.com and make sure and get those video replays. Because there's a lot of information that's going to keep you super healthy and very happy as well. It's a great starting point. So I'm going to bring something on screen here because I this is true story. I'm going through and trying to figure out what's the right sequence how to do all this stuff with water? How can we make it affordable for people at home to set it up and everything? And something that I would do? Because if I wouldn't do it, I'm not going to ask other people to write. So this is what are you before you jump into that yet just review for folks? What is in tap water that we probably don't want? Oh, because if you don't even know what IP I'll hear people say oh, the US has the best water coming out of the faucet and I can smell the chlorine. Dr. Paul right if it is not the best water and if it is the best water that is a sad statement or what's going on around the world. So let me share screen right now and I'll show you what's in my water. Okay, can we so what we did was we went first of all to ew G Environmental Working group.org They have a wonderful tap water database. So if you go to ew g.org Forward slash tap water, you can actually put in your zip code. And they'll tell you based upon what your municipality publishes what's in the water. So this is just fact coming. So let me show the audience what, what's in my water. Okay, so I put my I put my zip code in there and look at this arsenic at 693 times the safe level of exposure. Why? Chloride? 5.6 times right. And so what do we know arsenic rat poison. So this is a poison delivery system that it's become chromium levels. Halo acidic. gotta be kidding me that there's that. Where do you live? Dude? I live where they like to blow up bombs. I do some testing because look at this. Look what else is in here though Dr. Paul? Nitrates right nitrites by when he thought he got lasers and run off and stuff. But look at this radium, even and uranium. And here's your smells to another thing because my water one of the things when I moved here was and I live in Arizona. But one of the things that I first smelled when I moved here was I was like, Wow, this water stinks. Water is not supposed to smell. And this water stuck, but just absolutely stuck. And I was like, what is that? It's a try Hallo methane, methane gas. That's off gassing from there. So what we did was we said, let's find out what's in the water first, whereas you can go to ew G and you can figure out there's some stuff in there. And for me, I'm going to tell people like it is it's a bio weapon. But I know that really doesn't isn't really necessarily a great thing for a lot of people. It's a toxin. We can all agree their toxins, and they shouldn't be going into the human but we don't need 600 We're not arsenic deficient. We can all agree on that. I don't think there's a thing that everybody needs arsenic for not one thing. Yeah, no, probably not a good idea. So what we did was I said, let's start developing a purification process and affordable one, right? Because it's one thing for people to go organic, which we've been teaching at the Energetic Health Institute for decades, it's another thing to have to find out what other ways can people get sick and they don't really realize they're getting sick. One of those ways is water consumption with cooking out tap water where we're drinking tap, when you go out to to a restaurant, the beverage is made with tap water, you're getting exposed to these things all the time. And they might You might call them trace amounts, I trust me when I tell you, your body does not consider these things to be trace amounts, these are toxins that it's going to have to work to get rid of. So here's what we had, we stumbled upon something. And it's really exciting, I think, for everybody. And we talked about this at healing for the ages in my presentation on day two. So let me show some pictures here. I got it. This is what is so cool when you get into it, right. So what we did was my son and I started going through a process. And finally, we said what happens if we purify it and structure the water and then we freeze it what is the water look like? What you're seeing right now on screen is purified water, you see how you can see through right here, there's a clarity over in here, which you can see the structure that water can take. And so this was started to become proof of concept. And I've since had a number of students send me pictures, I usually get a picture a couple of picture or two about their water and what it looks like now that it's going through ice kids, but it's being frozen as you get a picture to a week now from students around the world who are trying this method and validating that this works. So let me show folks a comparison. We took my tap water and this is actually an experiment we did in Dallas right before the conference, the healing for the ages conference, we took in their circular because that was the mold we use we use I have a fun little mold to make ice cubes, they make some base beers instead of the traditionals. But we just took Dallas tap water and we froze it and look at this on the left. That's what it looks like. And then we took that same water and took it through a three stage process that I'm about to explain. And this is what that water look like after you get clarity and you get structured. And when you get structure and you get improvement of how cells communicate because the human body is two thirds to three quarters water. So we're improving how the body clean this is actually detoxing with by stopping it before it comes into your body. Right. So we get to we've seen around the country, what's in water with fluoride, we know is a big problem because it's going to bind magnesium and it's going to be a neurotoxin and it comes as a waste product of aluminum production. We know there's lead we know there's aluminum, we know there's chlorine, a lot of chlorine in the water right really bad. And that chlorine can create chloroform or a knockout gas. We know there's pesticide runoff, we know there's nitrates nitrites we know there's genetically infected micro organisms in the water that might be harboring some of these plasmids that Kevin mckernon has great work we know that there's also We're going to be rocket fuel in there, that's been confirmed, we know that the water that comes out of the top is called reclaim, meaning it's basically what was flushed down your toilet. So it's going to have residues of antibiotics and antidepressants and blood pressure meds and all the things that get flushed down the toilet when they have been expired. We also know there's going to be weaponized bacteria and plasmids, right. And especially plasmids that have been genetically modified in a lab. This is a big concern for us. So what we did was we went and looked at what's the correct what would what's affordable and what is a correct process for this, and this is what I do every single day. Dr. Pol, this is not something I'm saying, Hey, you should do this. I don't do it, but you should do it. I do this every single day. I am a water snob for real right now and will be a water snob the rest of my life. The first thing we do is we take a little food grade hydrogen peroxide, this comes from a company Dr. Ed group is put together as a 6% Hydrogen Peroxide. And we what I'll do is I'll take tap water and put it in a big old moonshine gallon jug, those old moonshine Dukes of Hazzard jugs, they're a couple bucks on mine. So you buy a few of them, I'll put that in, I'll put the tap water in there and then put a couple of drops of food grade not, it has to be food grade. And I'll put food grade hydrogen peroxide, and if you're at 6%, you're probably doing about 11 to 19 drops somewhere in there. That's all you need for a gallon. And then I'll set it out in the sun. You know why? Because water likes the sun. And water doesn't often get a chance to see the sun when it goes through all these pipes. So I just put it out there and let the sun hit it a little bit which wipes out a little bit more of any bacteria and stuff like that. That's what the prep step is doing is just getting out some of the bacteria. And then what we do Dr. Pol is we run it through a gravity filter. And the gravity filter that we've tested out that is the best right now is Alexa pure. We really love this filter because it is one of the few filters that has been proven to get out fluoride and some of those other molecules. Okay, we also and I'm going to give a big shout out to Berkey. Right now, because they're being unfairly targeted by the and illegally targeted by the EPA or the FDA, I forget which one I think maybe the FDA, the black Berkey filters are excellent everybody. So please do not feel like black Berkey these do not work. The white Berkey filters. I agree I have some concerns about that. But the black Berkey filters are excellent. Do not be afraid to use them. I have some waiting for me on backup if I ever need them. Okay, but you take that tap water that's got it that's sat outside and had a little hydrogen peroxide in it. And you just let it drained down there. And then when it comes out here, you take that water and you put it in a tabletop distiller and what that does is it cleans off all the final inorganic minerals that are in there, the minerals that your body can't use anything like inorganic calcium, it cleans all that stuff out and what you're left with is pure water. That is now impressionable. That means that this water that comes out after stage two, you can literally pray over and it'll start to form crystals when you freeze it. All right, that's what's so cool about this because water is designed to be in or I shouldn't say water is an adaptive medium, it will adapt to whatever it is that's why it's such a good carrier fluid on why it's so preferred. But now you have this totally purified and impressionable water and then what I do is I take that distilled water of course I cook with the distilled water teas and soups and things like that. I have a little meter that I put in after each batch to confirm that it's completely clean and it's completely clean every single time and then we take that clean water that purified water and then we can bless it. We can sing it songs which I do in the mornings most mornings was my water is pouring cold water I love you so much. Thank you for watching I'm gonna do for my body. We have some fun with it and everything as I pour it through this device now this is my favorite device I've ever purchased in all of natural medicine and and I purchased some really fun stuff, but this one takes the cake. This is called Aqua Energizer it's sold by pattern Durkin of the wellness enterprise and it is confirmed by the Massara Emoto Institute to be the most effective structuring device known in the world today. When it does when you pour the water through it is it helps water organize itself into a pattern that is very a for lack of a better description is just very loving to the human body. It's like the perfect way to have water. What's so interesting, Dr. Paul, when I take water over here from the distiller and I put it in ice cubes right and everything What happens and what happens is they're clear, they're clear as glass. But you won't see that structuring that I showed you earlier. When I run it through the Aqua Energizer and then freeze it, that's where I get that intense structuring. That's where I get that proof of Oh, my goodness, that water is now able to be impression. And in this case impression with something that's really healthy for my body. So what we do with all this is, let me skip through here I want to show just a couple more pictures is that water starts to do different things once you've taken it through the purification process. So when we've gone through and finished the distilling stage to distilling, we'll take the water and just sit the distilled water in the refrigerator. And I've put temperature gauges in there and everything. So at 37 degrees, this is what starts happening to water. Now water is supposed to freeze at 32 degrees. But at 37 degrees, it starts freezing in my refrigerator, because it is clean, it's purified. And so we get all these really cool pictures of water every time. And that's me pouring it through the structuring device. So this is just distilled water right here. It's not structured until it goes through the device. But you see all this intense stuff that's happening. And what gets really cool is I know it's time for me to change my filters and clean my filters on those units. When it stops forming water at 37 degrees, it's still technically clean, but it's an that's an it's usually takes me it's usually about a month. So I have to clean my filters, and change my filter in the distiller once a month. And that that's the cost for you. So you can set this whole thing up, right, you can set this whole thing up in with edit for about $500, you wouldn't be able to get the Aqua Energizer, that's gonna be the most expensive thing. And to me, it's worth it, it's worth it, I will not leave it as is I have given that as a gift to a lot of people because I love them. And I'm like, for me, I won't even let it leave the house now, like it stays in a very sacred place in the kitchen where I can see it every morning, because my favorite thing to do is to wake up and go and pour myself a glass of distilled water and structure it. And what's so interesting. Dr. Paul, when you pour that distilled water through the structure, for whatever reason, it becomes sweet. And it's like the weirdest thing in the world, but the coolest thing in the world at the same time, and it's the most delicious water you will ever have in your life. And it started out as polluted tap water. Well, there's your solution. Flint, Michigan, we got it. Wow. So how long does each of those steps take? Set? aside? How long do you leave it there? Maybe, maybe sit it outside for an hour or two. It's no big deal. And then it takes as long as it takes to filter down which for most people, if your filters are clean, the gravity filter will take maybe about an hour, but it's not like you have to do any work. You just pour it and then it collects. And then it is still there. How long does that take the distiller, you something you do overnight, so you get the distiller set up and then you turn it on while you're sleeping because it is going to have a little fan to cool it and stuff like that. So there's a little noise associated with that much. But yeah, you just turn it on while you sleep and you wake up like I woke up this morning had a big old gallon sitting there and we have we always have about two or three sometimes four gallons sitting on hand structuring How long does that take? seconds? He takes you pouring? Are you born drink? You want to you want me to go grab an ice cube right now. Let me show you let me show you some. Okay. I mean, it's like a great thing. You're not going to be able to see the structuring too great, unless I hold it up to the light. So I'm gonna try to get it up to a light. There you go. You can see a little bit. You see those lines up there is Yeah, sure. Looks clear and see through Yeah, it's clear. That's a structured Ice Cube. That's some good wire. Gotcha. All right. So Dr. H, I think you've convinced me I'm gonna go start fixing my water because I'm not happy with just my What do you call it the little picture and those into for everybody that's doing a it's like this. Don't feel bad for what you've done previously, because I used to just teach that all you needed to do was one gravity filtration and you were fine. It really is important to go from whatever filter you're using to a distiller that's the really the key step when I added that in that changed everything. And there's just unfortunately so much pollution in our waters now that requires at least two two cleaning sessions. Yeah. So maybe we can pivot because I know that you're the kind of researcher that man if there's information to be found, you find it. We are we've lived through three years of what is unimaginable that with the COVID Nonsense, but what you've been finding, because I follow some of your Work is a whole next level. And I don't want folks to think that I'm endorsing anything that's being said here. But I just want to give Dr. Ely a chance to maybe enlighten you a little bit to why this is another way of doing the water at the level you're doing it because some of the things that are causing ill health are showing up in our water they're showing up in our food. Of course, we're very aware of the dangers of the so called vaccines that are not exactly vaccines. I think for me, Dr. Pol, it comes down to how are they getting this kind of stuff into our bodies. You know what I mean? Like, when we're talking about real healing, we're talking about where's the root, if I can be effective at preventing or severely limiting my exposure to things that we know are going to be problematic. And we're designed, unfortunately, in many cases to be problematic, that I give myself and my family, my loved ones a fantastic chance at being able to navigate this really dark period that we're in right now we are in a dark period, I don't think anybody would debate that. So it beckons the call of what are the delivery systems, right? Bears are one of the delivery systems and fortunately, I think we can all attest to this is the sky. We've seen much more Chem trails coming on, I would encourage everybody to go and track down the work of Nikki Florio at be heroic be e heroic.com. Because she's done, in my opinion, one of the best exempt research dives on what's in those Chem trails that are up there. What we've learned is that a little bit of boron, and a little bit of humic acid, can help detox whatever you are breathing in unknowingly from those. And we're learning a little bit more about that. It's where my research is going now. So you can't stop everything, but you can purify your body and you can minimize your exposure. When it comes to water, we learn that water is a primary delivery system of a lot of the pollution and things of that nature, whether it's intentional, whether it's accidental, whether it's you know, just incompetence. That's for other people to debate, I know that it's present. And I want to make sure that people know how to purify that water, so they don't expose themselves to it. And that's what we just showed, it's very similar in thought to how we look at organic foods. And and making sure that why are we not? Why are we choosing organic even instead of the conventional foods, because we don't want the exposures especially to the glyphosate, which we know is been implicated definitively as in cancer acceleration and in cancer development in the human body, especially lymphatic cancers. So it's about saying, I'm going to I'm going to minimize my exposure to these things. That's why I make the choices that I make. And one of the byproducts of that of the choices we make. Yeah, it's a little inconvenient, for sure, right? But that's okay. Because the payoff is immense health and immense happiness that comes along with that health. And it makes it easy to do that work. And then you start getting these other cool things that come up that the food's tastes better, and you feel a little bit better. And it's why because I've severely limited if not eliminated, my exposure to a lot of the pollution just by understanding what the delivery systems for these things are. Our research, actually Dr. Pol has been going into the EMF frequencies and even light waves and frequencies. So one of the things I do like to get across to audiences, is the importance of turning off blue light on your phones and turning off blue light on your computer screens and your TV screens and things of this nature. You end up getting an EMF meter. I know you were thinking about that. Did I got it right here. Okay, I gotta, we've done a lot, right. Okay, so yeah, we got this one of my favorite ones right now, I think it's really simple. is called trifield. Okay. All right. It's a trifield meter. It does mag magnetic electric, and it does EMF. So right now, for example, if you can see right there, yeah, it has 0.032. And it's fluctuating. Yeah, I'm having very little EMFs in here have a cell phone nearby. You can hold near that. Yeah, let's see if this cell will do anything. I don't think it will. It would do something if we moved it over. Let me see if this is going to do anything. Yeah, it went up a little bit. goes up. It's still within limits. It's going up. It's going up 2.291 with the cell phone. Let's backtrack a little bit closer to the computer and bring it closer to the Wi Fi card and see if I can I'm going to angle it down at it. Yeah, it goes up 2.2 It's not very high here. But let me go and do a quick reading on my on my actual router. Okay, give me one second. I'm gonna go do one you're gonna have to take my word for but let me go get the exact number. Hold on. Okay. Hi. mark on this one Dr. Paul at the router was 10.6. Okay, the difference now that doesn't mean much to people until you understand this with this particular meter. Anything over 0.2 is considered unhealthy to a human body. So at 10.6, if I were to stand by my router all day, we have a problem, we're going to it's going to show up as what 5g does, on the lowest level that we know of is 5g punches little holes in our cells, it creates what are called Nano perforations in the so little small holes in that makes the cells more susceptible to infection, especially with smaller things and infection by smaller micron size pollution. So that's the big thing. So people if they go to my Twitter, I have whole videos up on Twitter, I have a whole thread of me driving around cities and showing I saw you do that. Right? Isn't that crazy? Like, I didn't know I was going to be doing anything like that, that's I look at myself, sometimes I do. And that's a little bit what their technology and their capability of what they know with frequencies and with light waves is so far beyond what I thought where I thought they were or where we could be with it just a couple of years ago. And so I had to step back and go, You know what, I'm under estimating these people. And I better stop doing that right now. So what we're doing is exploring how to use things like shung guide, little shung guide stones, but which we have tested shung guide actually does block electric frequencies pretty good. We're still doing some work on testing out we've tested a bunch of products that claim to be able to what are called said to be we remediate or minimize EMFs. So far, they haven't nIESR I'm not going to name them. I don't want to call anybody out. But what I'd say to people is, there are habits that do a much better job than the products do. And the habits are very simple. Make sure if you have a microwave that you unplug it and never use it. Microwaves in the kitchen are constantly emitting EMFs. And it's usually right at people's heads because most most of them are right like right above the stove and stuff like that. So we unplugged ours right away, I did a video on that showing how the difference when they're plugged in and when they're not when you're unplugged find when with the routers and TVs and stuff like that really simple. haven't plugged into a surge protector, a little five $6 surge protector and every night turn them off, and the EMF drop right there. And then in your bedroom, make sure that your bed is at least six inches away from a wall where your headboard is, and have a whole bunch of plants around because guess what plants do? Plants are the best remediators that we found so far of EMF frequencies. That's why it's really hard. Yeah, that's why when you're in Lansing, carbon dioxide and all that, but EMF two, they reimburse you remediate. They don't live in the forest. That's why it's so hard to get a signal when you're in the forest, right? Because they're doing their job because their root structure also draws that EMF and pulls it through the tree and puts it into the ground. And then it gets fascinating. After age. So all of this stuff to me used to be Whoops, oh my gosh, he's gone off the deep end, you know, and but the thing is, our our population is struggling with health challenges like never before. Yep. And so I think it's a cumulative assault on are at right at like you do cellular energy, right, energetic health is right down to mitochondrial energy and ATP and all that good stuff. And I think we've just tipped too many people over the edge, right. And so what you when you talk about these simple measures that people can do in at home? Yeah, it's not woowoo anymore, this becomes important. No, it's not conspiracy theory anymore. It's conspiracy fact, the intent we can all debate on. And we're not going to know until we get some investigations going, what the real intent is. But we don't need to speculate on that. We can just say, Hey, this is what's going on. And this is what we can do about it. Right? You have to stop being a patient, you have to start being a student, you can do that at a school like the Energetic Health Institute, where you have you can develop skills that are going to serve you for a lifetime number one, and to help you graduate. My promise to everybody is that you graduate healthier than when you started. That's the Hallmark to me of a good health education. So we make sure and we hit that mark every single time. I think when we're looking at this, there are there's chemical pollution there is going to definitely be frequency pollution, light pollution, that's why they're changing the lights out from incandescent bulbs to LEDs to blue light emitting LEDs. If your audience wants to go, you can just do a simple internet search on blue light and and its impact on depression and a lot of mental illness and sleep issues and things like that. If you don't have to get into what might be considered Woo, which is some of the stuff that I talk about that we back up with the science, the peer reviewed science, but just on that alone, that's a reason to turn off your turn on your blue light filters on your phone, and allow your body to not I can tell you I when I read that DARPA paper that DARPA study on blue light, and how blue light can activate latent things that had been put into the body. I was so blown away, that I immediately that exact while I was reading the article, while I was reading, the peer reviewed article actually turned off my blue light. In the first day, it was a weird kind of adjustment. But what was weird was that for the first time, Dr. Pol, my eyes and my brain, I could feel relaxing, I didn't realize how tense, they were just getting hit with this blue light. And by day two, I was like, I'm never going back, I'm never going to allow blue light to be on again. So like my screen to some people looks a little red. And I'm like, No, that's actually the way it's supposed to look. It's that blue light that's actually burning through your retina, and creating tension in your brain and things like that. And that's why people are having a hard time sleeping and getting agitated. And all this stuff. DARPA knows this. DARPA has been studying this for a while. So you there are so many topics we didn't even touch on that we could have been might have. But we're gonna leave those for another day. Where can people go because what I know about you is you never stop researching even the water because I've been in your courses. You are researching this back months ago and it progresses Where do people go to get your latest? You go to energetic health institute.org And that's really the hub for everything. If you want to listen to the radio shows, interviews, you want to get plugged in with the school. That's really where you go energetic health institute.org And I like you said, and I really appreciate this. It's just one big family. When if you feel like you've lost your family, if you've been ostracized from your family, you feel like an oddball out there. You feel like a black sheep you feel like a square peg in a round hole. We love you. Come on over and hang out with a whole bunch of other oddballs and crazies and weirdos and things like that, that believe in love and believe in doing things the right way. And I think that's the hallmark of all of us. Just integrity and love through everything that we do at the Energetic Health Institute. That's beautiful. I was going to ask you for your final thoughts, but I think you just did it. I'm gonna bring on the love master herself Didi Hoover, she's gonna usually get a little personal or else just play devil's advocate with you. We'll see what today. Okay, let's do it. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 37:41 Hi, Dr. H. Thank you for joining me and being willing to let me I'm gonna do both. It's either sometimes I get really personal other times I play devil's advocate, but you're getting both today my friend a. Let's start with devil's advocate. I'm going to my question is, I'm gonna talk about ask a couple questions based on what you said about distilled water. There have been a lot of reports more in the past I'm hearing more and more about distilled water being good. But I for years drink distilled water and was told by doctors and different people that could be why it was good wasn't getting enough nutrients. And that yes, it might help to drink distilled water to cleanse yourself or when doing cleansing for especially like kidneys or liver but that on a regular basis. We shouldn't drink distilled water and children shouldn't just drink distilled water. Can you talk about that a little bit? Sure. Dr. Paul 38:36 Up until the 1960s. The actual recommendation by the American Medical Association was to drink distilled water that it was the safest impure us to drink. They changed that for reasons we don't know. But certainly it wasn't based on any nutritional science. When we talk about mineral delivery, we're talking about your foods that you eat and what you drink. That's where you're gonna get your minerals. Okay. And then after that, of course, in this day and age, probably some supplementation is necessary just because of the assaults we're all under every day. But water is not water is a carry medium. It's not here to deliver minerals, but it can if somebody was really concerned about it. One of the things they could do is after they've purified the water, remineralize the water, and we do have some folks that do doing that with some fulvic minerals and things like that. I don't do it. But I also understand people who say they would like to do that for their own peace of mind. I think it's fine to remineralize it after you've purified it. But the key is making sure you purify it first. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 39:36 I prefer distilled water just because I react to so many things and I think that's because of sensitivity to certain minerals. So a little bit more on on the devil role here. Okay, so there's a mom sitting out there going, oh my god, Dr. H, that's just great. But who has time to do that? I can't leave my water out for an hour and there's no way I can do all the things you're doing. I have five children. I work full time. I think you're crazy. Okay, I added that last part I saw lashes Dr. Paul 40:04 right about that last part DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 40:07 with somebody who's looking at this going, I can't do that. But I want what's best for my children. They sell distilled water in the store? Yes in plastic. So what do you say to somebody who really doesn't have the time or the money to invest? I hear everything you're saying. And we do a lot for our water. And we don't drink it just out of the picture. Like, we actually have a nice purifier on water. But what do you what can someone else do that just out there goes on a trip and they want to steal water. Dr. Paul 40:38 I think there's a couple thoughts going to mind. Number one is if you don't make time to be healthy, then you're making time to be sick in this day and age. And it's just a sad reality. It's not a it's not a fault. And I'm not trying to guilt anybody into it, you got to make the decisions that are right for you, I believe in total freedom. So it's all good. But for me, I don't recommend anything that I won't do myself that's got us past that standard. First, even if it's a little inconvenient, I still got to this isn't inconvenient at all. This is about a $500 setup cost when you're talking about a gravity filter and a distillation unit. Most people already have one or one or the other of those. So you're talking about a less cost there. And then what you're talking about is a monthly maintenance costs and just a couple of dollars. So from a financial standpoint, you end up saving a tremendous amount of money over time easily because of all the money we do spend on water, which is ridiculous. Water is more expensive than gasoline. And most people don't realize that. So I think it's a lot of it is unlearning what we have to learn. And if you're a mom of five kids, that means some of those kids are old enough to help you with this process. And you make it a part of that learning experience for that. And I've seen so many moms do such a great job of involving their children in the learning process. So that's all the kids really know, like, I've always been a big proponent of, hey, you're coming with me to the store to shop, you're coming with me to the farmers market to talk to them and ask the questions. And now my son is 18. And he goes and does all the shopping. And he takes care of everything because he's got that skill set knows what to do. So what I'd say to moms is one big hug. Being a mom is no easy feat. That's why y'all get the best gifts on Mother's Day than better than dads and stuff on Father's Day. I'm about and there's a lot to teach and a lot to learn. But I would say to you that you the people you love are worth that little bit of extra effort, that little bit of investment at the beginning, and making sure that that you are putting clean, purified if not even only water into your family's body every day. Okay, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 42:44 and so do you agree then, though, on that note that if all they're doing is purifying their water or doing small steps, that's better than nothing? Because I think someone needs to hear that I think some people aren't going to be able to do everything you're saying. Sure. So they need to know what's the bare minimum that they can do to still at least provide the best for their children. Dr. Paul 43:04 Sure, the Aqua Energizer is an expensive piece comparatively, it actually costs about as much as the other the first two stages to set up. So if that if people can't afford that, I tell them and encourage them to save up for it, save up for it and make it a gift to yourself at some point in the future. But don't stress yourself out. Because once you've purified the water, it's impressionable. Once it's distilled, and that stage two, and now you can actually pray over it and give thanks. And it's going to form structure. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 43:31 Gotcha. Okay, next devils at Chauvet advocate. So when you talk about Bluetooth, I'm having fun here, when you talk about blue light. Have a blue light, or have a friend that has a blue light, and one of our roommates because of depression, and that the blue lights supposed to enhance? So now you're telling me blue lights bad? Dr. Paul 43:52 Yeah, I'm telling you blue lights bad God. I'm telling you that not okay. It's not okay. We have found DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 44:00 tell people this all the time. So what do you recommend for somebody who has depression because that's what I coach people on is depression. And I've always thought that it doesn't make me feel bad having the blue light around the house. Dr. Paul 44:10 And that's great for some people, if that's fine for you. Again, I'm not here to tell anybody what to do with their life. I'm here to share information that I've learned, right? When I read a study from DARPA, and a key person in this whole topic is a meat show already. We actually stumbled on this because we were researching anti CRISPR proteins. All right, and this is where the research took us. We were studying ancient bacteria called archaea and their ability to thwart all this CRISPR nonsense that's going on right now. And it brought us unexpectedly to that paper. So when I'm reading a paper like that, what comes up for me? First and foremost is I take them seriously. When when it's when DARPA is involved when the Department of Defense is involved with the amount of money they have and the amount that they brag openly about what they're able to do when you go read their peer review. Your literature, I take them seriously. They specifically talked about blue light, being able to activate latent plasmids. In the human body. We know plasmid delivery has occurred through the dengue shots. We know that Kevin mckernon has excellent work has shown that plasmids are far more rapid in those shots than they should be at all. And when our research did when once we got a handle on Kevin McKinnon's research is we I'm a historian, I wanted to go and know how far is this go back, it goes back to 1968. So we found some research by Dr. Walter doerfler, who was warning the world in 2021, about the shots saying, hey, you need to be really concerned about this. And so I went and looked through his resume. He's been he was in maybe the father of the adenoviral vector platform, warning the world about it. We don't even know if he's alive anymore. I reached out to him. EA, can it? Conveniently he lived in Nuremberg, Germany, if you can believe that. All right, probably hiding. So he might be hiding. Hopefully, he's hiding. But what it tells us is that they're far more capable of doing things than we can appreciate. And sadly, if it's shown up in a science fiction movie, they might have the capability of doing it. And that's how bad things are right now. So I take them serious. And I say, okay, what are you telling me to do? You're telling me that you're going to put blue lights up and all the street lights now, okay, that there's got to be a reason for that, telling me that there's blue light on my phone, there's blue light on my computer and everything, and it doesn't make me feel better. And it's one of the reasons why I had to start wearing these kinds of glasses because it was hurting my eyes with all the time on it. So what we've seen is that red light is a wavelength seems to be more therapeutic than blue light. It activates cytochrome c and mitochondria to help produce energy production. When you have somebody that is depressed, there are things that we have to get into in terms of their lifestyle, what's going on, what foods are you eating? Are you meditating or praying every day? Are you moving your body and getting good? endorphin release? Are you getting a hug? Are you getting touched? Are you eating organic foods, there's really so many things if you're right handed. To me, if you're dependent upon blue light to deal with depression, what you're really saying is that you've neglected other foundational things that would help turn that tide a lot better and a lot easier, right. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 47:20 And I don't know that it's a dependence on it. I think it's just that so many people, and especially with depression feel like being in the dark is better, and they don't want light. And I think that was terrible. So I did, but I wanted to definitely bring it up because that is something that I have always thought and I feel better. But then again, I'm always happy anyway. So I guess Yeah. Dr. Paul 47:42 Now let me let me just say one more thing. As somebody who has dealt with and deals with depression every year seasonal affective disorder. I deal with that every year. I will tell you firsthand, for me, it's about getting out in the sun. It's about getting out in the sunlight, moving my body and get in touch those things. Turn it around for me right away. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 48:00 But you don't live in Portland anymore. Dr. Paul 48:01 Amen to that. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 48:04 Oh, okay, so now we're gonna get personal. Are you ready? Dr. Paul 48:07 Yeah, I'm ready. Okay. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 48:08 So I heard you speak. My first introduction to you was a few years ago when we were at the Capitol, and you were up there. And it was like my first time at an event like that, and you were up there, and you were praying and preaching and I looked up and went, Oh, my gosh, I was with Dr. Paul at this event. And I'm in love. I love that man. I wonder if he's single. I love that man. He is amazing. Your spirit, your energy, and then you came into our office. And like, every time Dr. Paul would want to talk to you or interview you. I'm like, I want to see him. I want to be there. I just need to be in this room with this man. Because your energy is so shifts and amazing and powerful. Thank you. So first of all, everyone wants to know, Are you single? Dr. Paul 48:54 I am single. Yes. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 48:57 Okay, everybody can email me and I will let you know. I'll screen all the women that are gonna want to be part. Sure. Did you wait too long? I'm not single anymore. Dang, it. Dr. Paul 49:10 is just not right. A heck of a DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 49:11 lot younger than me. The hospital a part of the problem too. Anyway. You said you have a son that's 18 years old. Yeah. And so on. On the personal note. What's the best part of your life right now with your child? What do you enjoy most family Dr. Paul 49:28 time? First, one of the things I had to come into contact with and it was the lie. I was telling myself. I was telling myself that I was that I was family first because if there was an emergency, I would stop everything and I would immediately rush to wherever the problem was. But that's not what makes you family. First. What makes you family first is when you put family on your schedule first. And that took me really until this year to learn so what I did is I've wiped my schedule clean and I put family on in the morning family on in the evening and my work Old God is a member of my family. So that involves the Almighty as well. And what we do is we have definitive times, I actually have alarms on my phone now that go off when it's family time, and whatever I'm doing it stops. And if there is an interview or something that did get scheduled, or can only be scheduling that time, I don't schedule it until I get permission from my family, I say is it okay? And I think when you do that, you create a really great harmony. And what we've been noticing, since we've been doing that is now we have dinner almost every night together. And we have these great conversations about what's going on in the world, and what's going on in his world and what's going on in my world. And we laugh together and we hug we cook meals together. And it's just, it's a much better vibe. And I encourage everybody to explore it. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 50:49 I love that and I live my life felt so connected to you from the start is I live my life God guided and love forward. So I saw that in you in the very beginning. And then I had to teach Dr. Pol, I started watching over the last couple of years, watching you be on fire and swearing and throwing out this intense energy. And I'm like, I love it personally. But what do you think, brought that change on for you? Because I when I first met you, I saw this super calm energy about you all the time and being around you. And then it seemed like something changed for a while. And now I see it back. So do you mind speaking to that? Because you just share some things? What do you think, sure. to you that change that? Dr. Paul 51:34 What we really are is we're beings of light. But sometimes we're human too, right? And when I'm at my best I'm meditating every morning, and my work schedule is manageable, even though it's demanding. And when there's too much going on, I have a tendency to start pushing back because like most people, you just get a little irritated. Yep. What I found is for me, I do love to cuss. So that's a pardon me, right? I find people do cuss and I don't swear. And there's a difference. And I like Oh, can you explain that? Sure. I do not blaspheme. And I bristle it when people blaspheme and take Sacred Names and use them in a with negative intention. But when it's plenty fine to say dammit, in my world, but I do not put God in front of that, or you will see and hear from me and do not invoke Jesus's name in a negative way either and or any sacred, any of our sacred guides that have been in taught about love. Don't do that around me. And I don't let people do that around me. I check them gently. But I usually teach them why not to do that. Because that's swearing. Cursing is when you're just letting letting an expletive fly and it's just express out and those are the people that I found to be actually to be the most truthful in the world once that though, I like him a lot. But for me, I have many sides of me and I'm going to tell you DD I get angry every day I wake up in a certain level of low rage with what's going on. And I think it's okay. And I've had a lot of conversations with God about this. God is cool with what I'm doing and and I've, I'm very clear that if God is not cool, he will let me know about it. And I will change that behavior instantly. That's my promise to God. But I have to be me. And there are some times like I just went on a huge rant. Not too long ago on my radio show about I'm done with pro vaccine people I'm done. I'm done Qaeda, I'm done coddling their feelings of done with their insults to people in the gaslighting to moms who have lost their babies and things like that. I'm done. And I think what we I remember, my grandma said something. My grandma says when I was really young, she said a hard head makes for a soft ass. All right. And so I grew up in the era of getting switches and getting popped and stuff like that. And it was okay. It taught you something it taught you to be mindful about what you were going to say and what you were going to do that there could be a consequence for it. So I'm not one of those people that thinks it's a bad thing to spank a kid. You know what I mean? I don't think you should beat a kid. But I don't mind somebody flicking a kid on a year or something like that to get a kid's attention. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 54:21 That's a dad thing. Dr. Paul 54:23 That is a dad thing. Like, you ain't gonna do it. It's okay. And I get that I get that side of it too. But what I'm doing is I'm teaching and so for me when I'm expressing myself. It's it's actually really simple. This is how I feel this is what is what you get. Right? And I'm not here to be liked in every moment. I'm not going to change my behavior and how I feel especially if I'm well intended and working in God's divine light to cater to somebody's view of who I am or what they need you to be. If you need me to be something and I'm not being that, that I would encourage you to You're looking to go find somebody else, go find somebody else, because I'm not that dude. I'm the dude that's going to tell you the truth. And my truth is sometimes when I'm pissed, and I'm pissed, because I've know people I know Ernest Ramirez, I talked to Ernest Ramirez, often, I know what he goes through on a daily basis as a single dad who lost his only child, because he was supposed to be able to trust the government and these corporations. If you can't get angry about something like that, then I'm going to look at you and call you a coward. Because there are moments and there are times to be angry. And there are times to evoke God's God's direction on this in, which is that this cannot stand and will not stand for me, I'm just going to do, I'm going to just be me. And when, wherever, for better or for worse, that's when it's going to be. And believe me, I've lived my whole life with a whole bunch of people that don't like me, so just get in line. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 55:54 So you and I have a lot in common on that area. Yep. And I love you because of who you are and how you are. And you said, a couple of things that I want to point out to people is one I cuss. I did not know the difference between cussing and swearing, I've never used God's name in vain or any of that, to me, that's to me. It's just not acceptable period. And I don't allow it in my world. And I would certainly never do it. But I am I flip people off all the time. And people have been upset with me for that. But can I say that. But just wrap things up. And being new everything you've said, it's so powerful, and it's so important. And one thing that will like when we talked about maybe waking up anger, which I didn't know that you had any issues with depression, I always see this upbeat, powerful, positive person, and I've lived with people who've had depression for years. And being someone who's not necessarily depressed, we all have our bad days. But dealing with it sometimes is hard. And I appreciate that you're honest and open about it. Because I think other people need to know that there's like you said, there's the human piece to it. Just like our kids first forever program. There's physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual. And as long as that spiritual stays intact, and powerful and loving, no matter how angry you get, and God knows that I've been on fire when it comes to certain things, and I am a mom that's gonna stand up. Yeah, like you wouldn't leave. Being angry or frustrated is different, in my opinion, than being deceitful or mean, or needing to revenge or pushing how you feel and being angry to somebody else. I think we can do all those human things and still leave, lead with love. And live, like you said, with God being a part of our lives every Dr. Paul 57:40 day. Amen. I 100%, I'm with you. I'm going to tell you right now, that the there is but one judge, when I am not that judge. I'm not here to judge anyone. But I am here to do his work. And the permission that I've been given directly has been that I can do his work in my way. And so there's really one question that I and this way I teach my students to because that I get it when it's uncomfortable. I have a really great knack for making people uncomfortable sometimes, and I get that, but it's simple this. The question I asked myself is, am I Ill intended. Right? Right, because it comes down to intention. Now you may not like the delivery of what's going on. But you can you say that I was ill intended in what I was doing, because if I'm ill intended, now I'm violating my promise to God. That's my line right there. So I can do a whole bunch of stuff. Believe me, I get a pretty good carte blanche for the big fella upstairs to get this work done. But what I cannot do is crossed the line into being ill intended. And that's my personal check on myself. And there have been a couple of times over the last four years only a couple maybe two or three where I have fallen into maybe I'm being ill intended if there's some doubt there. And I've had to step back. And I've actually had to go and apologize I had a really sweetheart write me from Australia, she wrote me like this huge letter was like 30 pages long or something like that, about how much she loves me and loves what I'm doing. And just begging me to stop. Stop swearing. And I was at and I had to, and I had to explain to her the difference and like, I don't swear I cuss and there's a difference. But all this stuff. And I was like I don't know if that worked for I hope it did. But I just thought it was so sweet that somebody cared enough to write me a letter to say that. And my thing is if the people who are in my audience, my job is to earn your trust every single day and to earn your trust a new every single day. And if I'm not doing that, and I'm falling on it, I do give people in my audience the permission to call me out on it and I have to go into meditation and then check in and see is that true what they're saying? So when people tell me stuff, I do listen, and I do go and meditate on it. It may not change my behavior if my ultimate analysis has been that I'm still well intended in what I'm doing DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 59:59 and that's Powerful normally I just like Dr. Paul, wrap it up with what? What would you like to say? What message would you like to leave with everyone, but I think if you can just give one more minute on what you just said, and that is trust, we can't be everything for everyone. And so what would you just say to everybody out there about how people can trust themselves, because if they don't trust themselves, it's hard to trust someone else. Dr. Paul 1:00:25 The trust itself comes from first thought, the first thought is the heart, bringing in energy, divine energy. And that's where your first feeling comes from. And what happens for a lot of people is they don't check in with that immediately and immediately start rationalizing in their mind, that feeling instead of trusting it implicitly, when you're clean when you when you're good with God, when you're good in your meditation, your prayer, you go with family, that first thought is your spiritual guidance on what you need to do. And it's important for you to honor that, even if it is uncomfortable. For me, I honor my first thought implicitly, I never go against it. And sometimes that is I need to go up and say something to someone really harsh and shake them. And believe me, I've been and I'll be in public and somebody seeing somebody doing something stupid. I'm the dude that's gonna walk up there and say something. And I know that I'm in that moment, because God needed me to be in that moment, because he knew I was going to say something. So you know, I don't get in the way of that. But one thing I don't do is I don't second guess, myself. And that's where that's this whole sea of trust is our greatest commodity. And it starts with us trusting ourselves and where is our where are we really, we are our first thought, but only when we're clean because that first thought can be skewed by pollution in the system. And that's why Dr. Paul and I and everybody, we talked so much and teach so much about the importance of being clean so that the energy that does come in through you and through your heart is very clear and easy to decipher and understand. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 1:02:00 Thank you. I have renewed my crush on you. You're an amazing man. And I'm grateful for everything you do and for the work that you put out there. And if you ever need to be slapped up the head, call me. I'll be the one to do that. I'm gonna come to Phoenix in February and I'm gonna hunt you down and makes you spend time with me. Thanks for joining us, Dr. H. Dr. Paul 1:02:22 When you come make sure and hit me up. I'm going to be I'm going to be in Texas for about a week in February. So hopefully you come early in February. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 1:02:30 Okay, well, I'll make you I'll make sure you plan your whole schedule around me. Okay, Dr. Paul 1:02:34 there we go. All right, we can do that. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 1:02:38 Thanks for joining us. Hey, everybody, it's me, Diddy coming to you from my soul. day I'm gonna talk about love. What am I gonna talk about love? Well, because I interviewed Dr. Ely. And I had a massive crush on this man. Still do. And you're thinking that very soulful or spiritual? Yes. Because what made me so attracted to him and so many people in this movement is the energy, the love, the passion, all those things, doing the best for everybody. Medically, medical freedom, all these things. That passion just lights up my fire. Lights on my soul fires up my soul. I don't even know which all I know is that in my soul. Love is. It's so powerful. And being able to connect with people like Dr. Paul and Dr. H and so many more. Just really makes me realize how important soulful love is. Thanks for watching. Dr. Paul 1:03:58 I look forward to running together with the wind at our backs, revealing the science that gives clarity in our world that's full of propaganda and misinformation. Visit our website, doctors and science.com Sign up. Donate if you can. Your support makes a difference. And let's make this the weekly show the world has been waiting for. Thanks for watching. I'm Dr. Paul. Transcribed by https://otter.ai PDF:TEXT:Dr. Paul 0:04
Dr. Paul, welcome to with the web science revealed. My guest today is Kelly Sutton. She's been a huge supporter of mine when I was going through everything I was going through, and she's just been going through the same thing. Now she was trained 55 years ago, one of only 10 women in her class. She's had the same board issues I had with no prior board complaints, hospital complaints, malpractice judgments. The Medical Board of California came after her and took her license, and then other boards from other states followed suit with no complaints whatsoever. Dr. Sutton is fighting not just to save her career, but to save the future of medicine itself. Don't miss the powerful ending where Didi talks to her about her life, the personal story of her journey, and then her from the soul. Enjoy the show. Dr. Paul, coming to you from the heart. I wanted to talk to you today about ego and fear. And the antidote to that, which is love and soulful living. I lived in ego a lot towards the end of my career, and I didn't even know it. So it was just this. I'm in charge. Everything's about me and, and I went there and I lived there and I stayed there. And it's funny, not funny at all, actually, how those two things often go together. Have you ever been fearful? Might you be a little in ego thinking that it all depends on you. The opposite is such a beautiful place to be when you let go. It's not all about me. It's not for me to fix. It's for me to love. It's for me to be honest. It's for me to do what I can to be loving and soulful with everybody I interact with. I am so blessed by those of you watching who send love I feel it, who sends support, and the guests I have the privilege and honor to work with so many of them are so deeply soulful and loving. That's what I get to be surrounded with. And I would encourage you to do the same thing. Live with love, lead with love and surround yourself with loving soulful people. It will nurture your soul, it will bring you joy and peace and happiness and serenity. And take away what everything that we were trying to avoid ego and fear. So I wish for you a very wonderful 2024 And that you fill your world with loving soulful people, and living a life filled with purpose and love. Welcome Dr. Kelly Sutton to with the wind science revealed it is such a pleasure to have you on the show. Dr. Kelly Sutton 2:54 Oh, I've always looked forward to hearing from you and about you. Because I think from the very beginning, you were doing things with a level of courage and acknowledgement of the truth that was hard for doctors to do. And but you did it anyhow. You did the research on Vax versus unvaccinated even though the big people that should have been doing it, CDC wouldn't. So I just have to thank you for that. And you've been challenged, chased, and you've continued to spread the truth. And I hope you're feeling freer than you were at a certain point when you were in the midst of that, being chased down by the Medical Board of Oregon. Dr. Paul 3:39 Oh, so much for your and your time will come to folks, you're gonna listen to one of my true heroes. Dr. Kelly Sutton is also going through a lot of the same things I've been through. We're both going to tell you right here and now everything we talk about is for educational purposes only. We're not diagnosing or treating. So just to have that stated, you actually trained I think more than 10 years before I did I was reading that you've been trained 55 years ago. Yes. Yeah. Wow. You don't look like it could be anywhere near that old. Dr. Kelly Sutton 4:13 I'm there. I'm there. Dr. Paul 4:16 God bless you for taking on this challenge. This fight that we have on our hands that really we didn't ask for. They brought it to us. We trained back when there was a real physical exam and basic science physiology. Patients were an exciting challenge, write and write a guideline it was creative. You write that it was such a creative and satisfying experience. Dr. Kelly Sutton 4:38 Yes. Dr. Paul 4:39 You wrote that I want to hear a Martin Luther King figure for the profession of medicine. Voicing I have a dream about the future of healing to characterize where we go next for the next five decades. Dr. Kelly Sutton 4:52 Dr. Sutton give us your I Have a Dream message my dream for the future of medicine. Thank You and I want to hear yours too. And a lot of people, because I think that's the point we're at is recreating what has not worked, because it was hijacked. The dream I have is it, we can have the real art of medicine with the observation, the use of skills like palpation, percussion, using the stethoscope, the otoscope, everything, instead of being machine focused, right? In the old days, the patient and the doctor sat across from one another. And then the patient was examined by the doctor hands on. And the writing of notes, or the ordering of lab tests, looking at the images was secondary. But now it's like the patient is a sidebar. And the real question is, how do I document this? And the thing I noticed in the notes today is the chief complaint as the only thing that's still alive. I would like to see, when the chief complaint is stated that we then also go further in our history and say, what makes it better? What makes it worse? What have you tried? Did it help? How long did it help and get the full picture from the patient, which is not reflected in today's electronic health records. And that we could have a real physical exam, because right now, I think a lot of doctors are documenting physical exams, with only putting the stethoscope over the shirt or blouse, and calling that the examination of the heart and lungs. So I think those skills before they get lost, I would love to see those recaptured in medicine or in whatever profession is going to carry true healing. I think healing is built into human nature of some humans, that it's just an automatic instinct to reach out to try to help and to use analysis of the situation. And of treatment options are what's available. To help the person in need. I would like to see that nurtured again, like it once was in medicine, where it really called to a person's idealism. And drew together, people who wanted to study science could handle reading the science, and could learn the arts that I just described, deep skills and physical exam and history taking, and could use creativity because they were trained. We were trained in physiology. We didn't have to get guidelines. They were there. They were helpful. But we could analyze from understanding how does an ulcer happen? What's the story I'm hearing for the patient that relates to the physiology I know, to guide my next question. But I suspect Medical School and Continuing Medical Education Today is all devoted to understanding the guidelines, the charting requirements, and the things that make your practice stable and saleable from the regulatory side. So I'm hoping for freedom and the restoration of a real art of medicine. Dr. Paul 8:26 While I'm hearing you say, I have a dream that the patient doctor relationship is restored? Yes, we have freedom to practice the art and science of medicine. Yes, I think we need to have the freedom to allow ethical decisions to be made by the physician in consultation and with the patient, and that we not be bound by arbitrary guidelines that come from above, we really have got to get back to putting the patient first. And following our ethical duty to be of service to our patients. It was always such an honor, wasn't it to be the physician for a patient who needs us what a privilege we've had. It Dr. Kelly Sutton 9:09 is we're given a level of intimacy and intimate information and exchange with the person that is based in trust. And that is a huge compliment. It's the highest compliment and that's where we do have that privilege of being in medicine. And I don't think trust is cultivated any longer. It's not needed. Because the binary questions do you have pain in your head? Patient denies it or Yes, pain in the head is not enough. Right? Dr. Paul 9:52 I was chatting with my roommate last evening. He's all three to four years post cancer diagnosis and He went in to see his oncologist this week, the oncologist asked him one or two questions. How are you feeling? Great. Your labs look great. Put a stethoscope as you mentioned, right on the we used to tease the orthopedic point where you could listen to heart, lungs and abdominal sounds all at once. And that was the physical exam, the whole thing took less than five minutes. And that was it. He was just looking over his bill $600 Just for that part. And it's like medicine is being destroyed. Yes, absolute sort of just protocol driven science, I dream of parents being able to make every decision for their children about what goes into their bodies. Yeah, that we get back to uplifting the natural healing hour of the human body. Dr. Kelly Sutton 10:46 Thank you. We are too narrow. Healing is beyond pharmaceuticals alone, we have to look at the immense power that's built into the human physical design. And take advantage of that and understand it before we rock the boat. So thank you, that's another strong leg for the dream to stand on is to expand it to natural treatments. Indeed. Dr. Paul 11:12 So I want to get into your story. You were one of only 10 Women in medical school in your class. I think by the time I came along, 10 years later, I was 5050. So you were really one of those pioneering women, and you're fighting not just to save your career, but to save the future of medicine and the health of patients everywhere. So tell us a little bit about your journey. How did you end up getting in the crosshairs of the medical board. Dr. Kelly Sutton 11:41 I have always had vaccines in my office. And my patients pretty much always got tetanus and polio. But as we got into more and more vaccines, I had patients who didn't know that they wanted to have the pneumococcal the HIV, the rotavirus, the hep B. And so I would sometimes have those available because there was enough demand, but sometimes I'd have to order them if a patient wanted them. And then I was in California when 2011 California made a switch in parents rights to make decisions about their children's vaccine schedule. And they said that each parent had to be educated by a school nurse practitioner or a doctor and the provider had to sign that the education had happened before the parents personal belief exemption from one or more vaccines was considered valid and could be submitted to the school. About four years later, California brought SB 277. Under greyed out cry from parents flocking to the capitol and staying there in hot sweaty holes for an entire summer by a few 1000 in numbers, but to no avail. I'm sure it influenced the wording of the bill because originally it said only contraindications would be allowed for medical exemptions and no other type of exemption would exist. It's interesting that the literature the legislation did not address religious exemption directly. But everybody was going to state a fear and assumed this means the religious exemption is gone also, because the word beliefs was plural. That was probably a mishap of the legislative process that it wasn't brought up that Dr. Paul 13:40 we needed to effectively remove both philosophical and religious didn't it effectively Dr. Kelly Sutton 13:46 in people's actions. But whether the law actually is written to say that, I think has to be tested in court. We don't know for sure. But it was it left a very broad for the doctor's discretion to be the foundation of medical exemptions. And in the legislative discussion, Senator Pan said, Of course that includes autoimmune disease, family history. You don't even have to be the child's doctor. And it could be for as long as as needed. Just write a note. He made it sound very simple and straightforward. But when the time came, there was a shift in the media's coverage. Senator Pan started saying doctors are greedy. There's doctors selling medical exemptions. This is a for profit, effort. It's against our children, as though there was a divide between the exempting doctors and the public. And from my experiences in exempting doctor, I was receiving patients who had damaged themselves damage in the family and whose own specialists or primary doctor refused to write exemptions. They sought a out a doctor who was willing to do that. I knew what I was writing exemptions that I might have to defend each one in court or in summer, legal setting. But I was not supporting children going through college at that point, I was freer, because I'm older to do what I felt was the right thing to do. Dr. Paul 15:21 You had a sense that there was danger. Yes. Yeah. I remember that feeling when I wrote the vaccine friendly plan, or that fact my mom even was accusing my co author, you are putting my son's head on a platter. It was like you're doing something that is clearly not what the establishment has set out as what they want. Yeah. And that's what good science should be. Anyway, we should be questioning everything. Dr. Kelly Sutton 15:47 I think so and probably good education. And anything going should be questioning the status quo, because we're by design, always improving and evolving. Right? Dr. Paul 15:58 So back to your story. You didn't write hundreds or 1000s of exemptions, you just wrote, how many? Dr. Kelly Sutton 16:05 Oh, I wrote a number of exemptions, probably close to 1000. But I didn't keep track. But it was eight cases that were brought in front of the medical board. And parents were given the option of turning over the records immediately, but chose not to. And then they had to be subpoenaed. And I went through the process of a hearing and the question of a settlement that I was planning to move east to Massachusetts to be grandma. And it didn't make sense for me to accept a heavy duty probation and pay for a monitor, pay for charts being checked, keep an office in California where I'm living in Massachusetts. So I said, I don't want a settlement. And it went to a hearing in front of administrative law judge. And despite the fact that I had excellent witnesses, Dr. noin Shawanda, who's headed the maps program for years, Dr. Paul 17:05 and really founder and scientist. Yep, articulate Dr. Kelly Sutton 17:09 Yes, and powerful speaker. And he's been at the ASIC meeting, so he knows how the process of approval of vaccines works. And Dr. latrine Huang, who has taken care of children with Vaccine Injury through her work with homeopathy. And Dr. Andrew Zimmerman, whose incredible deep work in pediatric neurology has, with his colleagues documented that 30% of regressive autism is related to mitochondrial dysfunction. Dr. Paul 17:42 Yeah, he was the one that famously involved in the HANA Pauling case, right? Dr. Kelly Sutton 17:48 I think he was the co worker of the father of Hana, was it Dr. Paul 17:54 that might have been what it was, but it really showed clearly that vaccines can cause Yes. And in fact, that's what that case ended up proving they tried to save just because of mitochondrial dysfunction. I think many of us know that there are a lot of people walking around with mitochondrial dysfunction, like maybe all of us Dr. Kelly Sutton 18:15 were at some level it's acquired, taking Tylenol enough would probably give us all mitochondrial dysfunction. But the combination of some genetic vulnerability and then a few doses of Tylenol and a bunch of vaccines on a developing nervous system is a recipe for autism. Yeah. Dr. Paul 18:32 So back to your hearing, you actually went through one of these ordeals, right? Where your, your you got your attorney, and you've got your witnesses. Tell us a little more about how that went. Dr. Kelly Sutton 18:44 I was totally naive to the legal system. So I did not know what anybody's role was. The rules of the game were how to address or formulate a strategy. So I pretty much did, as I was told by the attorney, and then learned later that we should have asked for discovery, we should have asked for the opportunity to say who is the expert witness Deborah layman that you're bringing here and she's pediatric infectious disease. She doesn't deal with seeing vaccine injured children administering vaccines herself, writing medical exemptions. So essentially, she's not qualified. And yet, she was accepted by the players in the courtroom at that time. And it was this slam dunk. Everything, just trivialize what I was saying. And turned that whole outcome to be of course, you only use the ACF guidelines. And you only did that and anything other than that is an extreme deviation from the standard of care. So hyperbole about what was a protective action for children. and was not giving them a wrong treatment, but withholding treatment, which is part of the Hippocratic Oath, the first do no harm. And the decision was made to revoke my license. Dr. Paul 20:14 Wow. And that happened pretty quickly. I imagined it Dr. Kelly Sutton 20:18 did. And then I tried to petition for reconsideration, submitted the petition. And within less than one business day, 400 pages of documents were said to have been reviewed and rejected. So when they hadn't read it did an ex parte to the Superior Court in Sacramento. And the judge said, Look, this didn't happen, and called the Deputy Attorney General and myself for a brief hearing and asked him, What would the medical board do if it had the option to redo this? He said, we would out of fear. Rhys, consider this petition. So as my license was extended, probably an extra month or so due to my petition to reconsider. But ultimately, the same outcome was the revocation of my license in 2222. Dr. Paul 21:16 And so basically, you appealed it, they shot it down. And that's it for that case, is it done? Dr. Kelly Sutton 21:21 That's the administrative level. So I do have still pending two writs at the Superior Court in Sacramento. But I'm not actively pursuing those, because I want to work with the federal case with a group of doctors who are working with a civil rights attorney on that right now. Dr. Paul 21:45 I'm really excited to hear that before we get to that. One other thing you had happened to you exactly what happened to me I happen to have been licensed also in I was originally licensed and practicing in Oregon. I was licensed in Washington, my neighboring state, and I had some patients there, but they were driving to my office in Oregon. And then I had a license in Hawaii where I had never practiced, but I always thought, oh, I might retire there someday, and, and I can have a license, all those licenses fell like dominoes, and maybe tell us what happened to you. Because I know you had licenses in other states as well. Dr. Kelly Sutton 22:19 I did. And within 12 days of the first revocation by California, Massachusetts, sent me a letter saying, Oh, we're investigating you, please send such and such, or please just sign this document saying, you surrender your license, and you admit you're guilty. So I sent the documents and told them I was appealing. And for six months or so I didn't hear anything from them. And then they started getting revved up and began, what looked like was going to be a hearing process. But in fact, was a summary decision against my license and saying, based on reciprocal discipline, there is no need to reconsider anything. But the state of Massachusetts may duplicate the finding of guilt that the state of California found, and do what it chooses as discipline against me. At that time, I worked pro bono, with the help of attorney friend and other friends. And the battle was fierce, there was a lot of back and forth. And some amazing things happened in terms of just the way they conducted procedure. For instance, in my response to their motion for summary decision, I said, Please give me the points that you are saying are the reasons for this. Because in the Massachusetts law, it says that's required. And they said, that's if you're in superior court, but in administrative level, we don't have to do that. So I'm supposed to respond, been laid out for what I'm responding to. And that was my requirement. And at another point, I asked for something and the administrative master said, I will take that as a motion to reconsider. And here is the response. So he assumed that my asking was a motion to reconsider. He took the place of my attorney to call it that. And then he took the role that he had already as the administrative master to respond to it and deny it. It was an overtaking of rights. But what I'm learning is that's the way the administrative state works, that it doesn't have to be practicing real law with real orderly presentation of points, so that a person can respond or real roles defined, it can just say do this. And you can't do that. And here's the decision. So it's a tough part of our time to have this exercise of raw power in the management of regulating professionals. It's I'm not a professional. I'm more like parolee. And they're the wardens. It's no question that I've done something wrong. And they're watching really closely. What else am I going to do? Dr. Paul 25:21 When in fact, you haven't used simply did careful family histories, physical exams on your patients, and basically, you were saving kids who are at high risk for vaccine injury from vaccine injury. Wow. So that I had not known this term reciprocal discipline, but that's what I suffered through as well. So you lost your Massachusetts license. And I understand you have one in New York as well. Dr. Kelly Sutton 25:45 I had very briefly a New York license in 1982. I never activated it fully. I never practiced in New York, New York, like you not practicing in Hawaii. But nonetheless, New York said they chose to revoke my license to prevent the possibility that I should possibly consider at age 76. Starting to activate my license in New York and practicing there. They are preventing harm to the public, by revoking my license. Now, Dr. Paul 26:16 you You are such a threat of harm to the public. Dr. Kelly Sutton 26:19 Yeah, high priority in all of New York State. That's the worst criminal they've got. Wow. Dr. Paul 26:24 Wow. Tell me if you can, what did you learn about the Federation of State medical boards because I only became aware of that after I got entangled with this whole rigmarole with different states and all that. Dr. Kelly Sutton 26:38 I learned that there is a huge distribution of information about the status of my license and every doctor's license to the Federation to the national Practitioner Data Bank, to the IRS to the Attorney General's office, to many departments, and so we are under continual surveillance and didn't even know it. But as I have listened to Merrill nases case in which a member of the main medical board is on the Federation of State medical boards, even though Maine State law says, No person shall be on the Medical Board of Maine that has a conflict of interest. If you're serving the Medical Board of Maine, you should care about the health of patients in Maine. But if you are serving on the Federation of State medical boards, you have a different purpose that could conflict with what's going on. It may say that secondary, what happens to Maine public, I don't care about I want the profession of medicine to go a certain direction. But she would not recuse herself. So I now see the Federation as probably the linchpin behind the lockstep actions that medical boards across the country and around the world have taken in the last three years. And I've spoken recently with a friend who is a veterinarian, who does Holistic Veterinary work and is beloved by her patients, families, as you can imagine, because she gets good results. The pets live a long time and they're healthy, and cancers are reversed and there's less euthanasia, which is the automatic go to answer in veterinary medicine. And she her license is suspended in Massachusetts for two years. Awesome. Wow, I did not know that. Yeah. And there is an American Veterinary medicine board, American Association of Veterinary Medicine boards, that she contacted and said, Please tell me your sources of funding. And she's waiting to hear back from them. Dr. Paul 28:47 So that's my understanding is this federation of state medical boards. And indeed, there's the International Association of Medical regulatory authorities that you've written about. These organizations are not accountable to the public. They're not accountable to our government agencies or public health agencies. They're independently funded, I believe, to carry out what mission Dr. Kelly Sutton 29:11 I cannot say I've read their mission statement, but I have heard from Dr. Bruce Dooley, who now lives in practices in New Zealand, that in their meetings, they describe how to get the fringe doctors or the quacks and what policies should be introduced in their particular states. So the policies are written as a template. This is what you want to get introduced into law. So they're very politically active. And there is a real intention to get rid of doctors like us who are fringe, and in the old days, we were quacks because we use natural things to treat patients the least toxic thing for first. So that's anti competitive for sure. In a business sense, it's not fair practice. In an our free speech is restricted. So I think there's a lot of illegality going on. And we need discovery and deposition of people to understand where does the money come from? Because that's probably why those sample laws are being distributed to all the Federation of State Medical Board representations. And I think they're probably have a reach into every state medical board. Dr. Paul 30:35 Yeah, I think you're right. That brings us to the topic I'm really excited to talk to you about that is this, you've chosen to engage in what I think is probably, I know, you've stated it the most important civil rights fight of our time. And tell us a little more about what's going on. And then also how we can support you and give more information. Thank you, Dr. Kelly Sutton 30:57 physicians and patients reclaiming medicine as a new 501 C three, that is a legal defense fund, and a membership organization to collect interested patients, physicians, attorneys, and other providers who are being attacked, or who have seen the importance of this attack. As one of these things, it pulls the rug out from under all kinds of rights. If a doctor and a patient cannot work together freely, for the good of the patient, certainly parents rights are gone, the patient's rights are gone, those physicians rights are gone. And if we don't have bodily autonomy, we are under the state. There is no other control over us. If we don't have it ourselves. I'm glad to see that is happening. And we have had speakers. And we're still very tiny and new as an organization. But getting in contact with other organizations and other individuals who are gaining experience so that we can find one another and work together. Dr. Paul 32:04 Now that's super exciting. What COVID taught us what Tova taught us now, you and I were aware that there were problems with the childhood vaccine schedule, right way before most of our peers or the population at large, had any notion that there was any issue with vaccines and then come along this COVID fiasco, and people seem to be waking up. I Dr. Kelly Sutton 32:27 heard Steve Kirsch last night. MIT finally allowed him to speak in the university where he's donated money for a building. He was refused until November 30 of 2023. And he spoke about what his mastery of Statistics has shown that there's no question that the COVID vaccine has caused deaths. He says there's no question that autism causes is from vaccines. He said, There is no single instance of any case of autism, two weeks before a vaccine happens. But there's large numbers of cases of autism to within the two weeks after a vaccine. And he says that's enough statistically, and he discussed the Poisson distribution, which I don't know what it is. But I think it's the coming together of people with different skills like Steve Kirsch and Edward Dowd with their mastery of mathematics have really shown us a mathematical fact of what's happened that we know from our environment and the neighbors, and friends and what we read in the media, in spite of suppression. And that has to take a next step, once we've got mathematic approved to go towards things like lawsuits. Dr. Paul 33:48 Yeah, it's that same clustering of autism after vaccines that Steve Kirsch was talking about last night. We've seen the same thing with SIDS, sudden infant death syndrome, never being properly attributed to the actual culprit, and that's vaccines. Almost large majority of SIDS happen in the first week after vaccines, not the week before vaccines as high in one data set as 97%. But in all data sets and there's several of them. Yeah, well over 50% are in the first week after vaccines, sometimes three days after a vaccine. Wow. Dr. Kelly Sutton 34:24 And as bad as vaccines are. The worst thing is behind that. And that's the principle that's being established that you and I could not take care of a patient and give the patient with the patient needed. That freedom to function as a trained, ethical, responsible professional, does not exist. And so if that's taken away, then we really have big issues in how to conduct a human culture together? Yeah. When Dr. Paul 35:03 you were opening with me, you talked about trust, and how important that trust is between the patient and doctor, that relationship. And you and I have had that privilege of having trusting relationships with our patients for decades. And that has been completely eroded when, just for example, the COVID, that's most obvious to people who are watching doctors get paid reimbursed for vaccinating. And there are bonuses and incentives. And then of course, the public has been incentivized by or threatened, you're going to lose your job where you can't go to this event or that event, or you can't travel, or here's a doughnut or a lottery card, just ridiculously unethical practices. In any time prior to this. We would have been brought before a medical board if we coerced a patient to take a medical procedure. Yes, Dr. Kelly Sutton 35:59 these are bribes, there should be no detailers from with gifts from pharmaceutical companies to medical students and doctors, there should be no financial incentives for doctors for certain treatments, or lab tests or anything else. Those interfere with medical judgment. There's no way for it not to. Dr. Paul 36:21 So I'm curious, you've been at this even longer than I have? What happened? What happened to our profession? Where are our peers, we've got in my field pediatrics, almost all pediatricians will just follow the basic guidelines without questioning without looking at any other data. They just start told this is what you do, and they do it. Where do we go from here? What happened Dr. Kelly Sutton 36:44 to different questions, but so important, I think we got lazy and greedy. And when insurance came in, and it paid anything, we were happy to charge high prices, we lost our moral footing. And we didn't charge fair prices. So then there had to be clamps put back on us. And the family practice doctor became the secretary for the system, filling out all the referral authorizations and so that the lab could make money, the X ray department could make money, the referral specialist could make money, but the referral had to come from the primary in that in those days family practice, doctor and we didn't complain. And then I think one thing I've heard Richard emerling say is the workload got so big, that doctors did not any longer want to work alone. So we put ourselves on the employment role of a hospital and became their doctor. And we've had fewer and fewer doctors in private practice. His assessment of what's gone wrong with medicine is very insightful. He said, In the 90s, there was, or maybe it was part of, I don't know if it was Clinton's medical plan, or Obama's probably Obama's, there was a plan to say, medical visits could only be paid through insurance, you could not pay out of pocket. And he said, that's a key point of control. Because if a person is free to pay out of their own pocket, they have freedom to choose a different provider than that easy, covered, cheap provider. But so he said, we have to have things put back so that people are paying and choosing their provider with their finances. And the private practice of medicine has to be restored as one answer to your second question. And it has to be strong. And we have to have fewer physician employees and more physician self employed, because then we have the chance to use our own values. The doctors in Kaiser and setter were not free to write medical exemptions. And they were told that and so there are patients who are deprived of that option on as a mass as a block. Dr. Paul 39:19 And that might be how some of them ended up at your doorstep? I think so. Yeah. I had that same experience in pediatrics in general that patients were kicked out of other practices. If they weren't following the CDC schedule. They would show up at my office and we take all comers and monitor informed consent. And so I had this growing population of under or unvaccinated patients, which you would think would be a disaster given the common knowledge or the thought anyway, that vaccines are safe and effective in this wonderful Naisha and cure all. The funny thing was the unvaccinated are the ones who are so healthy. And I got to see that firsthand, which was like whoa, what's going on here? Yeah, That's very insightful of you. So with your efforts with PP RM, how do people get information from that organization? We're joined to support you. Dr. Kelly Sutton 40:11 Thank you. The website is reclaiming med dot o RG. If people want to go there, they can see what the Saturday meetings are. Like, we have a forum. And you can sign up for the newsletter for free, you can get notices of when we have a guest speaker. And then as a member, you get access to the recordings of prior guest speakers, and the forum and a section of the website that isn't available to the public. And we love having the experience of doctors who are dealing with medical board issues, because we think in the combined experience and insights, we're going to have a chance to understand how to approach the issues we're dealing with, and also have the talent collected to help write articles to reach out to people through social media. And see if there's ways that there's more awareness, we would like to make everybody more legally literate, because doctors are not legally literate. Parents are not legally literate. The things I've seen happen with parents who had exemptions in California, and are then told me you now have to register this in this thing. And the schools will routinely say you just sign up for it and you'll get put in your exemption there. But putting your exemption in to the system means two things, your tract and your exemption will be denied. I've never heard of a single exemption put into the care system that was accepted. Except for one. And that was a doctor who is still being investigated. And it was a 12 month exemption. Dr. Paul 42:01 Effectively medical exemptions are gone, aren't they? Dr. Kelly Sutton 42:04 Yes, yes. And they're really one person pointed out they are not medical. They are administrative. So it's a bureaucratic exemption that the parents are getting. And that's so hard to get in California. Dr. Paul 42:19 Yeah. I'm often asked if I live in California or New York, or Maine or Philadelphia or West Virginia, I think those are the states Pennsylvania sorry. I think those are the states currently that do not have a philosophical or religious exemption. Oh, and parents will say what can I do? And what would you tell them? Dr. Kelly Sutton 42:39 It's I hear occasionally, about this doctor will give exemptions, or this school will work with the parents to get the child educated. But I think those are like, rare as hen's teeth very difficult to find those that can with the answer seems to be to go on with creating the new world to start your own school, which is easier at the preschool level than other times you just share with other parents find a church that welcomes its congregation and work together, you make a private Educational Association, so that it is a contract between parent and student and teacher. That is doesn't include the government. It's not taking government money. It's not licensed. Because it's when we allow the government access through a medical license, a school being licensed, that we then have to comply with. We have they have access to us, and then we have to comply with the laws, whether it's giving vaccines or receiving vaccines. So a person can homeschool or move. Those are the two hard realities. Yeah. Dr. Paul 44:01 If you're a parent listening and you are faced with my child is now going to be forced to get less heaven forbid, but they've added the COVID jab to the childhood vaccine schedule starting at six months of age. I just can't even fathom the insanity of that right decision that was made almost unanimously by this committee that supposedly is looking out for our children's health. Clearly our organizations are captured, right? Yes, the very institutions that are supposed to protect us are now right out there harming us left and right yes. So homeschooling has to start becoming a real reality for any thinking caring parent Yeah. Or like you said move. I'm gonna wrap up and have Didi join you for to function I gotta miss this D always gets to the fun personal stuff. Okay. But as I depart, I want you to have a final say about if the audience could listen or remember one thing. Dr. Kelly Sutton 44:56 What do you want them to know? It's you And one thing I forgot, and that is to go to school board meetings. And I'm volunteering now in my grandson's library at his little kindergarten school, public school. So I get to see what are the books like that are there? What are the people like? How much computer use a lot of things. And I go to the school board meetings once a month, and I'm thinking about going to the school to the town council meetings. I think it's that local involvement. That's the other leg. It doesn't educate our children. But it's something maybe for the grandparents who carry while the parents are figuring out whether to homeschool or vaccinate or move, because the parents are carrying the biggest load on their shoulders. I think maybe that's the last thing I should say is that tremendous admiration I have for the parents who are going through this experience. They have born the child love the child obeyed the doctor suffered from all of those virtues, and now deal with a chronically ill child that they are continuing to be devoted to and to raise. And the things I'm going through are nothing compared to that. So it's Dr. Paul 46:18 I second, third, fourth and quadruple that. That's why we do what we do. And thank you, Dr. Kelly, satin, you are an angel on this planet on this earth. And thank you for being on the show with me. Here's DD. Dr. Kelly Sutton 46:30 Thank you very much, Paul. Hey, everyone, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 46:33 it's me DD and I am here with Dr. Sutton V. Dr. Sutton, you just saw a wonderful interview with her and Dr. Pol. And I was cleaning to every word and everything you said. And when you were talking about exemptions and different things, I have found myself starting to tear up because as a mom, I did some exemptions, not exemptions. But I did refuse some vaccines for my son when he was younger, because he was sick. I did the initial one. So my heart as a mom is so appreciative of you and but very sad that you have to go through what you are going through and what you did, because you were doing what's best for children. That hurts my heart as a mom. But thank you for everything that you do. So my first question is, are you just mentioned your grandchildren? So talk to me about how many kids you have? How many grandkids you have? I see that brings a smile to your face your Dr. Kelly Sutton 47:32 it's a real connection point, whether it's a doctor and patient or meeting someone is how do you have children because it changes your life once you have that experience? So I have two wonderful sons, who are around 40 years old now. And one of them has two children. And I get to babysit them twice a week and I'm delighted. Oh, yeah. I love that. Yeah. And how old are they? five and three? Okay, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 48:02 so is it the five year old that's in school that you were talking about going to the library? Yes. And for your children for 40 years ago? Did you vaccinate your kids? Dr. Kelly Sutton 48:13 I did. Okay, I learned conventional medicine first. Okay. And so I did what I learned. But then, in my practice, my patients started teaching me and some of them had problems, a man with dramatic myositis. I have to thank for his story and his asking for help. And I searched for a research program to put him in. That was conventional medication. Couldn't find one. So I asked a friend who said she had helped her rheumatic fever, with nutrition. And then she wrote out the nutritional program because I couldn't at that point, and he got better. He still looked like he had dermatomyositis. But he was functioning. He was swallowing he was doing his gardening and he was no longer depressed. So I knew the power of other types of healing from what my patients told me. And that was just the beginning of opening everything. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 49:19 How many years would you say you were in practice when that happened? And maybe turned around how you felt? Dr. Kelly Sutton 49:24 That happened? Pretty quick. Tucker, I started practice in New Mexico in 1970. And that's about the time that the American Holistic Medical Association was founded with Norm Shealy and Gladys McGarry. Okay, I knew them way back then. The early days of Jeffrey bland. There was a lot of famous figures in just beginning things at that point. And then I met anthroposophic medicine, the work of Rudolf Steiner, which kind of brought everything together. It has a big picture cosmology behind it Just like are you Vedic and Chinese medicine? Do ya? What's it the context of the human being the local, the family, the community, the cosmos. In that framework, I could put everything I was learning from patients, whether it was nutrition, detox with colonics, homeopathy, homeopathic remedies, herbal remedies. Some people had experienced faith healing, healing with radionics. All of those could be grasped and formed into useful tools. Through the work of anthroposophic. Medicine. I didn't use all of them. But I think that the whole difference was being able to say, what is the human being? And have an answer that you could count on? This is deep, this is real. Because that question wasn't really answered explicitly. In medical school, it was more implied that the eye is a camera, the brain is a computer, the heart is a pump. So we're just a big inch machine. We're a big Incredible Machine, we're broken, we fix it. But with anthroposophic medicine, there was a picture of the person having a spiritual nature, which was eternal and unique. And soul or emotional makeup, a body of life forces, which was called the etheric body, and then a physical body. So with that complexity, there was many angles of understanding the sickness of the person, and of helping to treat. So it's just been a very rich learning experience for all these years. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 51:36 That's awesome in that you can embrace that because a lot of medical doctors, like after I've helped I do body work, and through the past 30 something years, sometimes some of my patients back pains or different things would get better. And they'd go to the doctor, and they're like, oh, it's that's nice. Go ahead, but you should probably still have surgery. And it's, it just always surprised me that it was just put off, and that's changed in itself. So you just said Gladys McGarry? Yes. Name. I had an opportunity at a massage conference. Actually, she did a speech and I got to talk to her. And she's amazing. Do you feel like that's did you learn much from her? Because he just mentioned her name. But did you ever have an opportunity to because she went through the same thing with her past, and how she chose to step right into doing things more holistically. Dr. Kelly Sutton 52:25 I knew her so long ago and have not kept touch that I probably had more discussions about her work in the 1970s than since then. But I know she did amazing things with the Association for Research and enlightenment, the ARV healing centers in Arizona. Yeah. And I imagine there would be parallels if I spoke with her. Yeah, I've DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 52:51 been trying to get her on the show. Talking to her she is she's amazing. And that's what I see in you, though, is that you're not afraid to fight. And I think in some of the email conversation, you said that if push comes to shove, it's more important to you to have an effect on helping families and kids and people receive the best medical care and health care. And I think that's something that you'd said that I've noticed is sometimes we think of it as just medicine versus a well, wellness, health and wellness. When you think of health wellness, I don't think we always think of medical doctors. But I see that in you. And I think that's why they're coming after you is because that's not allowed. Yes. So did your kids ever have any issues with vaccines? Dr. Kelly Sutton 53:36 I'm sure there's levels of injury in them and myself. I don't think there's any contribution to achieving full human potential that vaccines provide for I think they are a burden on our system and probably diminish by bits, our IQ or coordination or relatability, some of those finer functions, but because we're such an amazing, we've been given this human design, we have a lot of reserve and over eons, humans have been through a lot. And now we're going through this. I think we're going to survive and be stronger because of this. It's mostly my patients because I was practicing still when DPT was a vaccine. And there were a number of people in disabled homes because of the DPT vaccine from an early age. Oh, wow. Yeah, I DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 54:31 didn't even think of that. That's, and that's the thing, something like that. When you see that even back then and now seeing what we see with the COVID shot. To me, it's so clear that wow, this is harmful. We should stop but are you did you were your grandkids vaccinated? Yes. Dr. Kelly Sutton 54:48 And my daughter in law is a NICU nurse and she believes in vaccines, but she did spread them out. She didn't give the whole aid of one visit. I I think I want to mention one other thing from my early training. That besides seeing what happened with DPT, I also saw the sense of hesitation about too many vaccines that was truly the prevailing medical opinion in the early 70s, because I did a CME course that was on hepatitis and the gastroenterologist preventing presenting it said, there is coming investigation on a hepatitis B vaccine, but we won't need that for everybody. We'll just need it for those who have active Hepatitis B to prevent it from becoming cancer, and possibly people who are of Asian descent because they're more prone to that. And now we give it to babies in the first 24 hours. The shift the medical thinking that's happened. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 55:51 And even to infants, I just read an article on a set of twins that was born three weeks early in the shot was given to them. And now they're saying, June well, so I just I think, all of that's nonsense. So I have I think I know the answer to this. But if you could go back and do it differently, would you if you knew what you knew now that they were going to take your license or challenge you this much, would you have written those exemptions? Dr. Kelly Sutton 56:17 I would write them, I would probably be more aware of telling parents what they needed to do. Because I think in a sense, doctors writing exemptions made the parents think the problem was solved. We took the parents load on but that was a false answer. Because it was so temporary. It was undone in the next several years. And that little bit of tide helps because kids get more maturity, and there have more solid neurodevelopment to withstand other assaults. But still, I would have told parents, you need to do this, you need to do that. And I think all of us as a culture need to be involved in the government, whether most importantly, we do it locally, school board, and so forth. And we need to be legally literate. I knew nothing about law. And so I was just Paddy, in the hands of medical board attorneys. And sadly, the ones in California were not very strong defenders of doctors, they just felt we have to do what the medical board wants. And so that's what happened. And I know of no doctor in California, who was not disciplined. If they were in the situation I was in everybody's case it was last universally. So we need to have stronger self defense and legal defense. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 57:56 I agree very much so on that. So we have I don't know. But Dr. Paul and I have we co founded a program called Kids First the number four ever, and it's physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual aspects of our life. So if everything that's happened to you, what kind of effect would you say has happened to each of those areas with you? Do you feel like you have been affected negatively based on everything going on? Dr. Kelly Sutton 58:22 I know I've got wear and tear on my on all the parts except the spiritual probably yay, because it's just a lot to endure. And there's the stress of carrying the load of work to deal with the onslaught of tasks required. And then now the tasks are how do I pass on what I know. So it's not lost? So it's a very joyful, constructive building effort, but it's still I'm not gonna live forever, I better do this. Right. And then I think a lot of rebuilding can happen when there's some space and rest, but that time is not now. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 59:09 And I appreciate that you said that because that's the thing is, and it's just like with Dr. Paul, when he was going through this, it was affecting his health, his physical health, and mentally and emotionally and luckily, same thing, that beautiful, soulful, spiritual side of him, which I see in you, is still strong, and they can't take that they can do all the other things, they can take licenses, they can do all that but they can never take who you are. So thank you for that and how much work you put into it. So I know I'm running out of time. So okay, what, what's most important and can you say to other grandparents out there because you're in a situation where if it was your baby, you probably wouldn't vaccinate knowing what but there's this fine walk we have to do a fine dance we have to do with our children on that issue. What would you say to other grandparents Dr. Kelly Sutton 59:57 about vaccinating or God? DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 59:59 Yeah, about being having your children vaccinate your grandchildren, or how to how can grandparents get involved? Because you mentioned you're going to the school board meetings, you're going to school? Yeah, I think a lot of grandparents don't feel like that's maybe their place. And same thing a lot of grandparents don't feel like they can say anything to their kids about what they know about vaccination. Now, how did you do that dance? I Dr. Kelly Sutton 1:00:25 think we have to let our parents let our children be the parents of the grandchildren. We are not the grandchildren's parents, no question about that. So there's going to be things we see whether it's toilet training, how you brush your teeth, diet, vaccines, bedtimes that they're going to do differently than what I did, or what I learned from not doing it right the first place. So I would just play with the family and enjoy them. And then stop waiting for permission to go to school board meetings and town council meetings and volunteer in the school environment. Just go and look at a group like moms for liberty, who are very aware of issues that happen in school boards, and find your voice because you can do something your children cannot do because they're way too busy. With prayer as grandparents, we have to use our time in a constructive way. This is not a time to retire. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 1:01:23 Thank you so much for saying that. And,man, I agree with that. If that's the one thing that anybody takes from this is an especially I think sometimes parents are put in a different situation. If they speak up too much or say anything, then sometimes how their children are treated like a school. Yes, my son was treated negatively based on me speaking up. So as a grandparent, it's like a parent can go hey, that's her opinion now coughing. So thank you. Thank you so much Dr. Sutton for agreeing to interview with us. And please know if you ever need any support that you can reach out to us. Thank Dr. Kelly Sutton 1:01:59 you Didi for asking beautiful questions and for the encouragement because that lets the healing begin after everybody going through things. So thank you for that. Oh, you're welcome. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 1:02:12 Thank you. Hey, everybody, it's me DD and I'm coming to you from my soul. Today and my interview with Dr. Satin. It really made my soul shine, because she had mentioned her in her early career in education and training. She had the opportunity to meet Gladys McGarry. She wrote the well lived life. She's 102 years old. Actually, I think she's 103 now and she is still practicing medicine. She they call her the mother of holistic medicine. And boy, are they true? That is so true. But what lit up my soul was what Gladys McGarry has passed on to everybody. She lives a life of love. If you read her book or you have a chance to listen to her, it will light up your soul. It did the same thing for Dr. Sutton and Dr. Sutton lit up my soul today because she's she's not letting everything that's happening to her. slow her down. She is pushing through. She's making a difference. And when I asked her, you would you go back and do things differently? Yes, you know, you might think about things differently. But no, she would always put Kate patient care first. And that's what doctors are supposed to do. That's what medicine is supposed to do. And that's what our soul is supposed to do. We're supposed to put our health, our energy who we are our life, our love first. So thanks for listening, and have a great day. Dr. Paul 1:03:55 I look forward to running together with the wind at our backs, revealing the science that gives clarity in our world that's full of propaganda and misinformation. Visit our website, doctors and science.com Sign up. Donate if you can. Your support makes a difference. And let's make this the weekly show the world has been waiting for. Thanks for watching. I'm Dr. Paul. Transcribed by https://otter.ai PDF:TEXT:Dr. Paul 0:04
Dr. Paul, welcome to with the winds science revealed. Today's show, we interview Mary Holland lawyer who was faculty at New York University School of Law for 17 years and is now President and General Counsel for children's health defense. She has co authored or CO edited several important books, including HPV on trial, vaccine epidemic, and turtles all the way down. I have all those books and have read them they are powerful. Did he interviews her about the experience at Children's Health defense conference in Savannah, Georgia, and of course wraps it up with from the soul. Dr. Paul, coming to you from the heart. I'm feeling called just to share a little bit about fear and prayer. You know, can we live confidently, no matter what's happening, I sometimes stumble and find myself getting a little fearful. And then I'm reminded, prayer doesn't have to be this one moment in time, where I maybe get on my knees, nothing. Nothing is anything wrong with any style of prayer. But prayer when it's an openness, a listening, a connecting, and an asking a trust in God, a trust in your Lord in the higher power in love in spirit, whatever you use to connect. And when you have that trust, and it's a dialogue and you're open, it can be a living, powerful force in our lives. And when you're in that faith space, I found fear just disappears. Our world is giving us endless opportunities to connect, and to stay in a place of love. That's what I wish for all of us. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 2:07 Here, everybody, it's me, Didi, and I am here with the Mary Holland from CHD. TV. And you all know that our show is on CCTV. And so some of you that are watching this watch us on CHD TV, or they watch it through when we send it out or on doctors and science.com. But we just did the conference rise and resist. And Dr. Paul and I spoke at it. And Doc also spoke on his own about what's happened to him. And many of you know that we travel and we're part of this amazing freedom groups medical freedom against medical tyranny. And Dr. Paul and I both have this passion for preventing harm and increasing children's health and wellness and vaccine. What's happening vaccines is something that we talked about and we're passionate about. We'll see each D does that and so much more. So we decided I should just come on. This is live. I'm in Alabama. So the background is a little different. But I just invited Mary to come and talk to me and talk about so my first question is, first, if you can explain just briefly for those that are on our show. And I've heard about people who've watched doc show and CHD. But they don't even really know about how CHD came in into reality, how it got started and what your position is. So if you could explain that, that'd be Mary Holland J.D. 3:26 great. Sure, happy to pleased to be here. Children's Health defense took over from a group called the World Mercury Project. It was started in 2007. And it was really focused on Mercury and very laser focus on so Marisol Mercury containing adjuvant that was used in vaccines pervasively, is now used in trace. And they made the film trace amounts, which is a great sell. Bobby Kennedy, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. got on the board, a world war three project and helped to promote the film trace amount. And then basically that organization, Bobby became the Chair of that organization. And then we changed the name to children's health event. So I came on to the board of children's health defense in 2018. I'm a lawyer by profession. And then I came on to the staff at Children's Health defense in 2019 as the General Counsel. And then in 2021, I became the president and general counsel. And then this year, I took a leave of absence to work on Bobby Kennedy's political campaign, but then came back and I come back just as president and we have an acting general counsel for which I'm very grateful. Oh, that's DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 4:37 awesome. Okay, so that's your role now? Is that something that you plan to continue? Do Is this something so I guess the next question is, what's your personal involvement? Like why even in the beginning, why did you come on What? What happened personally on your lungs? Mary Holland J.D. 4:56 Yes, I came from a very medical family. Both my parents were physicians, I considered going into medicine and two uncles were doctors while blocked. I have a 26 year old son and he was vaccine injured. So that's what got me involved. And you know, first I focused on of course, biomedical interventions. And then I realized, Oh, my God, this has happened to every planet virtually, I the only way we're going to change this is to do it collectively. And so I got very involved in advocacy and worked in a variety of different groups. Autism, one, went to Dan defeat Autism NOW meetings and got to know many of the people that you and I both know, in the medical and legal side. And then when I had the opportunity to come to children's health defense and do this as a as my work, not as a volunteer, I jumped at the chance. Oh, that's DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 5:48 awesome kit. So can I do you mind sharing more about your son? Like, how old was he when he was affected? Like, what would it do? Ya Mary Holland J.D. 5:57 know, he's not one of those cases where he got the shot. And immediately at 105 fever and high pitch reading his his case is different. His was more sort of gradual in retrospect, he was a first child for me. So I didn't see all the signs in the way I would have if I'd had a child developing normally. So, you know, in retrospect, I see that he was developing some sensitivities. He was developing some repetitive behaviors, his language a little bit slow, but there were different ways that I could rationalize that to myself, and the doctors didn't pick up on anything they and I, we had actually some pretty good pediatricians. But then fortunately, a little bit late in the schedule, he got the MMR and measles, mumps, rubella. And now in retrospect, you know, he'd been getting all these thimerosal containing shots and Mercury containing shots, preservatives, and you know, so his immune system was probably already pretty, pretty impaired. And then he got three viral live viruses in his vaccine. And he basically fell off a cliff, he didn't have an immediate, immediate reaction. But he over the course of a couple of months, lost his language, lost his sleep, started doing all the repetitive things, like, you know, fans and whirly gigs and, and then started Splinter skills. Like when he did have a little bit of language, it was like, you know, to recite a book of 60 pages by heart, I mean, really, really? Yeah, he was on the what would be called Autism Spectrum Disorder, for sure. And fortunately, I learned about defeat autism Now very quickly, after, you know, very quickly after he regressed and started doing biomedical protocols to help him and I found down doctors and he's substantially recovered, but not completely, you know, his his life, my life, the all of all of our family's lives have been completely changed by that experience. And in today's world, DD on some level, I feel like we were the lucky ones because look at all the devastation and death from the COVID shots, and we were never gonna go need DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 8:03 you. I know. I know. And that so How old was he when he got the MMR? Mary Holland J.D. 8:09 He was two and a half. He was one was recommended, which is probably a thing in disguise, but he fell off DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 8:16 the cliff at that point. Okay, so he was really young. Because that's what I always you know, I'm fascinated by a lot of times, it's like for my son, it was when he was older than all of the, you know, the more of the damage and things that took place. So I'm always curious, like, when and we have so many people who watch ours. I mean, all of you all have seen HDTV, but especially with our show, we have a lot of people who watch it and want to know like, when did you notice it? And how did you notice it? And like you said it was the first child? And we do not every child develops? Normally not every child has a fever reaction. But like with Dr. Paul's research, and it sounds like a lot of what you've done too, is that it? It's health, and that's why I love when I heard about children's health defense. I'm like, wow, I that's the whole point is we're trying to help have a healthy society. How do you do that, too? I work with children is preventative. So you, you mentioned you have other children? I don't have Mary Holland J.D. 9:19 other children. No, I just have one child and he's now not a child. He's a man. But he's doing well and I'm grateful for that. But you know, the injuries are lifelong. I mean, his injuries are lifelong injuries. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 9:32 Yeah, they're and I have just one two are not a multitasker people like why did you have more children? Oh, don't ask. So, in your work, what do you find the most rewarding for you? Mary Holland J.D. 9:46 Well, I always find it rewarding DD when people have avoided harming their children, you know, when I parents who say I read one of your books or I learned you know what you said and I decide not to vaccinate my children. I always see that as a triumph. Really, that's, you know, that's one child who was spared any possibility of the severe injuries that are possible. I also find it really rewarding as a lawyer, we won some important victories. We had the minor consent law turned around, you know what we got an injunction. We've seen the mandates drop because of litigation. We've got important litigation going on right now related to censorship. So that's exciting. Just seeing, you know, I've been in this movement for over 20 years. So to see we had a conference is, you know, over 1000 people were there. We have millions of people who watch the HGTV who read our daily newsletter, Defender, I have the satisfaction I we have friends around the world, we have a chapter in Africa, we have a chapter in Europe, we have a chapter in Latin America, we have a chapter in Australia, we are part of a global powerful movement that's gaining steam. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 10:56 Wow, I didn't realize it was all over the world. I knew it was some but so how many chapters? Would you say there are in general? Do you have a count? Yeah, Mary Holland J.D. 11:07 I am not the minute we're forming new chapters, we have chapters in about 20 Odd US states. And we have groups that we work with health freedom groups in other states. And as I say, we have chapters in other continents. So we're about 30, all together, but we, you know, these different groups do different things, depending on what the issues are in their territory are in their state. But really, there's just fantastic grassroots action going on around the world. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 11:37 It is do you think, how do you feel because this was going on before? COVID? What do you feel was the biggest impact with COVID? Like, how did how did it affect children's health events? The pandemic, the lockdown, Mary Holland J.D. 11:50 I mean, the pandemic, the lock downs, the mass, the shots, the testing, it woke up a lot of people that there's clearly a coordinated global campaign going on that relates to control of populations through the vector of health, right. So essentially, our constitution was suspended. Churches were shut down. Around the world constitutions and fundamental rights were suspended, economies basically stopped. So I think all of those things brought people to children's health defense. I think, you know, the vaccines, we still haven't seen the end of the damage from these shots. I think the masks were incredibly harmful, especially to young children and to people with special needs, who have sensory issues. And I think the lockdowns killed people, I mean, the lockdowns clearly caused, you know, millions of children to move into poverty. Girls were sold off and marriage at very young ages, I mean, the pan the pandemic was a disaster. And the notion that we should now put the World Health Organization which declared the pandemic in charge of global health is absolutely literally insane. DD, it is insane. And one of the things that we must do is to stop that from happening and 2020 for the first half of the year, there will be a lot of efforts to have the World Health Organization literally become the the sort of the centerpiece of a kind of a new world order. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 13:23 I know, it really hurts my soul. I pray on it all the time. But it's just I mean, even hearing it when you say it, again, deeply disturbed, because when I think about all the children, like you said, how the pandemic affected them in itself. And I work in pediatrics, and I'm working with these children who've been affected by it in so many different ways, and we had some suicide in our area. And I'm work with those families. And I just when they think about that, I don't understand why nobody's like catching on to that and how that's even become a thing. And so my question for you is, how I know what I'm going to do to, you know, to make the changes and help but what do you say to somebody else who's hearing this? What do you say to them about? What what can they do? What do we have to do as a collective, but what can people do individually? Right? Mary Holland J.D. 14:19 There are so many things, Diddy. First step, of course, is awareness. The first step is to realize that we're not in the world. Certainly, I realized now I'm not in the world I thought I was in I thought I was in a very different world than I'm really in. I really do believe that. We're looking at a kind of global takeover of governments for the people by corporations, and this is really all for money. And it's really for the corporations and people are not high on the list, right? These are corporate interest and make money and to control people to subjugate people to to make people more malleable, so that They can be easily controlled. So there's lots of things to do. One is to be aware. So sign up for the free defender, watch the HDTV, sign up for your local CHD chapter in your state. If you go onto our website, you can find the chapters in the left hand hamburger menu. If you don't have a CHG chapter, join a different health freedom group use that National Vaccine Information Center portal, you can find out about what are the bills in your state, or you know, find out about what's going on in your country get active join other people in your personal life there, you know, use cash is one of the things that Catherine Austin Fitz, who's on our shows, Thursday mornings tells us use cash, it's anonymous, you may you know, if you in your pension account or in any way, if you're invested in pharma get out of pharma, they're not our friends. We don't want to be investing in Pfizer, but probably you know, the fortune 500. The s&p 500 is gonna have fun. So if you don't want to be building the prison, as Kathryn Austin Fitz would say, you know, make sure you're getting out of those investments. Those are some of the things DD that people can do. Outside of being devout. Sorry, my weakness. There was a local election here. But next November, you know, is another election for state and federal officials, vote for people that you believe are going to support your rights, especially your rights to health freedom, don't you know, go to local school board meetings go to local county official meaning stand up against this tide of tyranny? DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 16:38 Right. And I always tell like, when I talked to some moms that just say they're very fearful of talking to others, or sharing or whatever, and I said, the bare the bare minimum should be stand up for yourself and your child. Just choose not to comply. So after we spoke, and did our two month visit, we came out, just walked out the doors, this woman followed us out. And she said, Well, the easiest way to do what you did to sum up what you did is just when you go to the doctor, just say no, thank you, and keep saying no, thank you. And no, thank you. What I explained to her and the reason I don't coach that way, is yes, that's how you stand up for yourself. You just say no, thank you, and you're welcome to walk out the door. Where I find that to be an issue is for someone who is weak. And that's why I say bring somebody with you and make sure that person is on board with your decisions. That's also important, which I didn't point out, that person is on board with you then when they tell you, you know, well, this is what you need to your child. And you say no, thank you. Doctors are mean. And again, I'm they're supposed to do no harm. But I don't always know that they feel like they're doing harm. And so they'll push and the greater good and the money and whatever it is that they try and use just by saying no, thank you. I don't believe that changes anything. And that puts you on defense. And so for me, I always say, you know, learn everything and do everything. And when you make your decision stand behind your decision, say, this is why I'm choosing not to vaccinate, not just no thank you. But I don't think we're going to change pediatricians or people around us. If we just say, Oh, no thank you and walk away. Do you kind of feel the same way? Mary Holland J.D. 18:16 Well, a couple things. I really liked your idea of bringing somebody who's aligned with you to a pediatric office, it's too easy for a mom to be intimidated by somebody in a white coat. It's just tragic, but it's real. And we see that all the time. So I love the idea of if you have to go to a doctor's office and avoiding it altogether is another strategy. Go to a pediatrician who is open to your viewpoint. You don't want to go to somebody who's a doctor, who you're not aligned with. So you want to first of all, find pediatricians that are open to not vaccinating but should have to go for some reason to someone who's not on your team, though is somebody else. I also just recently edited a book called turtles all the way down vaccine science and myth. This is a great book that has questions for your doctors and I would encourage you to buy a copy. It's actually self published on Amazon but buy a copy and give it to your pediatrician or, you know, open questions for your doctor and ask your doctor all those questions. The doctor can't answer your questions, doesn't want to deal with you and will kick you out of the practice and then you'll find a better meeting trician or nurse practitioner or naturopath or whatever you can do in your state but you don't want to go to a doctor that you believe is bullying you that's just a bad idea. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 19:42 Yep. And, and for many, many reasons I feel like and that's what we try and show in that visit is that if they're not willing to listen or respect where you are, and we included in this last one I've been called just a moment I actually embrace that because I believe that has power people like you're not just a mom, no, I am. And what just a mom means is that I am fully on board with making sure that my child gets the best care. I didn't do it before. But I'm damn well gonna do it now. And I'm for sure gonna make sure that other parents at least have what they need to do that. And I believe that's what you and ch D does with the standing up to people and the, Mary Holland J.D. 20:27 you know, we don't need fancy degrees and we don't need somebody else's, you know, stamp of approval. I say, you know, we're animals and as animals, we're mammals, we're kind of failing our young right and the job, especially mothers in the animal kingdom is to fiercely protect their young and we are not protecting young people against what are toxic injections. And the science now is so clear Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and Brian hugger just came out with the book Baxton Vax turtles all the way down is truly a really helpful book. It's pretty clear, you know, these these, I just read a story today Didi have a baby that you know, toddler that went to her 15 month visit and two days after getting three shots, she's dead. You know, these are not harmless exposures. And they're, you know, the the media, the health establishment, sadly, they lie to people. These are very toxic exposure. Some people do fine. You know, some people can smoke two packs a day for 70 years and be fine. Other people die and 50 have lung cancer. You know, some kids won't get autism, some kids will become paraplegic. Some kids will get add some kids will have depression, some kids will have other complications, autoimmune disorder, some kids will get asthma, and some kids will do fine. But now many more than half of American children have some kind of chronic health condition, be it obesity, asthma, allergies, ATD, ADHD, autism or cancer. So, clearly, these products are not helping overall public health, which is what they're designed to do. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 22:11 So you know, right. That's what, that's the thought process, right? Because when somebody called me an anti Vaxxer, I'm like, No, I'm pro health. Give me a shot. That's going to protect me but not harm me. Mary Holland J.D. 22:23 I'm all in Yeah, but they don't have those. Unfortunately, they you know, that's in there so severe that the industry in 1986 had to get indemnity from the government National Vaccine Information, the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Act, or react and VI A, which basically indemnified industry, and then it became a gold rush, right, then there was lots of money in it, and there was no liability costs, and you can mandate the products. There's nothing like being able to mandate your widget, your market affect liability. I mean, that's what this is. It's an incredible scheme that violates every notion of markets. It violates every notion of you know, responsibility. It's insane, right, toxic products that are mandated on children. That's what this is about. And it's crazy. And it's gonna just die. Ed, we're getting we're getting very close to the tipping point here. 24. I just saw a poll from Rasmussen from early November 24% of Americans believe they know somebody who died from a COVID shot. People are we not have the level of legislation trying to protect people to make their own choices. More and more people are trying to opt out of routine childhood vaccinations. The science is really clear at this point. Didi is the science I mean, just getting clear every day, science is really clear that this there's these products were inadequately tested. And they have a huge array of side effects as DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 23:53 well. And it's, it's very sad. You know, I feel like it's a bitter the COVID shots a bittersweet thing in reality of, it's very sad what it's doing. And my own family, I still just, I can't even talk about it without bawling, but just the buy in knowing and sharing and their own friends. My I have my aunts all in this older group of women and two of them have already died of cancer, one of them died just recently, you know, and there was all within a couple of weeks at the COVID shot and the woman is still getting boosters. So my I just it's a struggle on that in. But you just mentioned What did you say there was a study Rasmussen, Mary Holland J.D. 24:30 there was there's a poll, there's a polling organization called Rasmussen polls, and they just did a poll early this month, November of how do you think that you know, anybody who died of a COVID vaccine 24% of Americans say yes, they do. And what's really impressive is that that number is about the same for Democrats and Republicans. There was a lot of differences between Democrats and Republicans about all the COVID measures. There's now prints between Democrats and Republicans and recognizing that they believe somebody who was you know, died from their exposure to a vaccine, the whole idea of a vaccine is supposed to protect you from deaths D. And we know that, you know, COVID was not as severe I would predict it to be. So the notion that people are dying from these vaccines is horrific. It's just terrific. You see, I DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 25:19 think that's the thing, the fear mongering, is it setting it over? Can you just in a legal aspect to share your opinion and the importance of bears? But when I was bringing up bears to one of my friends, she's like, Oh, that's just false reporting. So what do you say to somebody like that, that says that, oh, people just go on and claim stuff? Ah, Mary Holland J.D. 25:45 so two things, you know, the vaccine adverse event reporting system was created by statute by law and the 1986, National Childhood Vaccine Injury act, it was required, because if you take away litigation, as a way to impose liability, we have to have some way to find out if these products work or not. And then there were supposed to be Reports to Congress to make vaccines safer. They've never been made safer. They've only gotten more dangerous over time. But the truth is, is that there's is only probably catching 1% of adverse events. How do we know that? Because the Centers for Disease Control itself in 2010, commissioned a study by a gentleman named Phil I believe Solomon, and he was working for the Harvard Pilgrim Health Association, and they were doing machine learning. And so they looked at in a child maintenance organization at who was vaccinated. And then when did they come back to the health service? And what did they come back for? What they found a co DD? What is that? It's a staggering number. It's about two and a half percent. So a really high percentage of people get adverse events from vaccines. And when the CDC found that out in 2010, they literally didn't pick up the phone anymore. So they want to know, but we do have the VCA data. So in COVID, the government promised us that they would be rigorous and they would be tracking all injuries. And they created an app called the D safe vaccine safety app. And Aaron Siri and attorney for ICANN had to FOIA Freedom of Information Act asked for the information. And when that was exposed, it showed that there was over a 10% injury rate. These are unacceptable injury rates, and you have every diverse data is the government's data. The V save data is the government's data, if anything, it's underreported. So DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 27:44 can we change that? Because like Dr. Pol said, not every book not and most doctors don't even know how to use it. They're not even reporting it. Well, I don't even know about it until COVID. Mary Holland J.D. 27:57 I wish that I thought that were true DD I think that what we've heard a lot during the pandemic is that people were in hospitals told not to report so there's lots of disincentives to report it. First of all, it takes time, time is money. Second of all, the hospitals are the ones who are giving the shots, they don't really want to have a high injury rate from their hospitals. But all you have to do is look at the versi. It's open. And the the easiest way to find veirs is there's a link called Med alerts like medical alerts, meds, med alerts.or, and go to that, and you can look at it yourself. And there's just a staggering number of injury and death reports. And we've just got to stop this and the good news is DD is that people aren't going to get the boosters. The good news is it's about two to 3% of people who are getting the COVID boosters, they're still pushing them, but people aren't taking them people are wising up. And we have to be really happy about that. And we have to take some credit for that. That's because of the work we've done because the government and media have been pushing the same narrative since 2019. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 29:02 And I think that's the other part that I find so insane is that they know that there's harm so okay, fine, don't take them off the market, but to bribe people to do it. To tell kids that they can't go to college or go to classes or do things if they aren't vaccinated to childhood scheduled putting it on for a six month old. Mary Holland J.D. 29:21 And that's crib I mean, truly DD This is criminal stuff. You know, this, this is criminal stuff. There's no, you know, these most recent boosters were never even tested and children, they are literally expecting people to basically sign up as lab rats. And kudos to the people who say no, I'm not a lab rat. Right. I DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 29:42 think that's the most important thing and I wish like when we go to the conferences and things I tell I told Dr. Paul, I feel like we're preaching to the choir. And that's why I feel like our part when we talk is the communication piece and sharing with other people. You're the people that are hearing it knowing it and have exposure variants the damage. So this is how you talk to other people, because the only way that most people in society you're gonna get the information is one of us is willing to share and talk and make ourselves vulnerable. And you know what I mean? Yeah. Mary Holland J.D. 30:14 I mean, this is the question Didi, how do we reach people? It's not easy. You know, the advice that Robert Kennedy always gives, and I think it's the right advice is not to preach not to try to educate people is to ask questions, you know, why do you think that? What makes you think that who did you hear that from? You know, it's it's getting them to open their own minds? Oh, gee, I heard that from the CDC. Well, how did that work out last time? You know, you know, oh, you're from the who? Well, aren't they the ones that sort of had to backtrack? And, you know, have you heard about, you know, anyway, it's asking questions, to open people's minds. And it's, you can't change somebody's mind in one conversation. That's rare. It takes time. No, it takes time. But we're all working at that Diddy and recognize that we are all being censored, right? In social media. In print media and broadcast media, anybody who is going against the government narrative, and the government narrative, let's not forget is the unvaccinated are the ones who are the problem, you know, they're gonna get sick and die. That's not the reality. But that's the narrative. So and DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 31:19 now. And so. And I know you saw our presentation, that's one of the first things that my dues list and when I coach families is to ask questions. And I think the other thing that I tell people is that every person, even those that are, that are asleep, and following the CDC, or what the government says, everyone has something inside of themselves that want to help other people, we're helpers. So when I'm talking to somebody, I'll always ask, Can you help me understand why so it's a question, but if I asked them for help, you know, help me can I, you know, if I say help me with something, it seems like then people, you know, especially men, they want to help, they want to be the fixers, the the, you know, let me tell you, what's right. They want to help. And I think that's when people start to question their their selves, is when they're trying to help you understand, and they realize they don't even understand. So that's one of the things I share anyway, who knows if it works, but so what do you see in the next year? What do you see for everybody? Mary Holland J.D. 32:29 Well, I'm already looking a lot towards 2024 to 2020. Fours. I mean, we've got, you know, two wars going on in the world right now. We've got a lot of really frail leadership, globally. 2024, we've got elections in this country, we've got elections in Russia, we've got elections in China, there's a lot that's likely to happen in Europe, they've just basically embraced the digital ID for the European Union this past week. So there's a lot that's going on. I do think people have to be prepared that there could be some new crisis in the world. And being mentally prepared for that it I do believe makes a big difference. So I do think we're going to have a rough year to be honest with you, dd, I don't think 2024 is going to be smooth. I think it's gonna be a rough year. But I think we've got some really fantastic institutions and groups and people, and we can strengthen one another. I can't overstate how important it is to find your tribe, to make friends in the health freedom movement, if this matters to you, and if you want to keep your kids unvaccinated, it makes a huge difference to have people to support you in that and to reinforce in you why you come to that conclusion. So reach out. You know, I do our show with Polly Tommy each week, you know, pray big, don't settle. You know, never settle. You know, just stay strong. Stand firm, stand firm, don't settle, never settle. I guess she says down firm. Never Settle. Pray big. That's that's what we do. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 34:12 And lead with love. I always tell people that it's like, no matter how much you're against something, if you lead with love, it seems to be the most powerful weapon that we have. So I do my best to share that. So, question I love asking everybody whenever I do the interview, is if you could go back, say 30 years or actually back like even before you made a decision to be a lawyer. Would you do anything differently? You know, knowing what you know now, Mary Holland J.D. 34:43 would you want to be a doctor? No, definitely not. No. I consider being a doctor and I'm so grateful because I would not use I think I would be in the shoes of you know, I? I can't really think about going back Diddy. I mean, I wouldn't undo I love my life. I love what I I'm doing I think what I'm doing is meaningful. But you know, like everybody else, my son has suffered terribly I've suffered. That's part of the human condition, I don't think I would go back and do anything differently. You know, and I'm not quite sure what the future holds, but But I look forward to continuing to live the life I've lived. I mean, I look back. And I think that a lot of the experiences that I've had very much contributed to who I am and what I'm doing today, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 35:31 right. And I have to tell you how much I love that marriage, because that's one of the things again, when I'm coaching parents make the decision, and moms have so much guilt, and people have asked me the same thing, would you? Would you have stood your ground firmer with your son when it came time to make decisions and things? Or would you, you know, if you knew what you knew, now, of course, she wouldn't vaccinate if you knew that. But I think one of the things that I admire you so much is that you have taken what's happened to you. And you're living in the way that you're living in a way that it's happened for you what you've gone through, and I think that's the, you know, I always try and tell people, things happen to us, but we can choose to see them, they happened for us, and you're doing so much with what happened for you. And you're sharing in the way you do it is so beautiful and respectful. And, again, I know how overwhelmed you are, that you but it's really important to have, for me, especially to have people that I can look up to and see what you're doing, and how you're doing it. And I don't know, maybe you get told all the time, how great what you're doing is and the difference it's made. But if you don't, then I'm here to tell you that so I hope you never stop. And if you ever need a cheerleader, I am your girl, I am right there with you, I will follow you around, hire me and I'll be your assistant, because what you're doing is so powerful. So thank you for joining, do you have any closing messages you'd like to share with everybody out there? Mary Holland J.D. 37:01 I just you know, I know that many parents struggle with guilt. I don't DD I didn't know better. And I did the best that I could at that moment. And guilt is not a constructive emotion in this, it's just not constructive. So is you I just want to if anybody feels guilty, like, you know, I should have known better, you didn't know better you were lied to you were lied to every day by people in authority, you didn't have reason to know better. But now you do. And so there's really I get like the the guilt and that the sadness. But both of those are emotions that really you can channel to the change that you want to see. So that this really does never happen to another child. And we haven't succeeded in that. But we are gaining we are gaining we if I look back over 20 years, I like Gosh, Didi, the scale of where we are now in our movement is just extraordinary. People are just not taking the boosters or not taking their kids, we've got bills in every state in the country, over 700 Positive bills for more choice when it comes to vaccines. There was not a single COVID mandate in a public school ever, despite three years of effort, there was not a single new mandate passed in any state in 2023. We are making a difference. And you can take your personal tragedy and your sorrow. And I don't mean to I don't mean to under estimate the tragedy of all this and then the horror and the sorrow. But when you're ready, and only when you're ready when you're ready. There are lots of us who would benefit from you participating and helping us to get over the finish line and that is to end any medical coercion. It's absolutely unethical, and it shouldn't be unlawful. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 38:59 And I agree with that something that we are always trying to say like if somebody does the guilt thing is that when you know better, you do better. And I think that's what we're all learning. Everything you just said is to that note that when we know better we do better. The other thing is my when my son was 16 years old, and I was going through everything due to the heartbeat shot at 12. I remember falling on the floor and crying with guilt. And he walked up to me and he looks down he goes, What are you doing? I can't even use the explicative that he said to me at the time. But he I said, I just feel so guilty. I did this to you. And he looked at me and he actually popped me upside the head and goes, the vaccine did this to me. You didn't do this to me and you didn't know. And I always tell parents that whenever we're talking is that we have to think we have to put the people hold the people accountable for doing it. And if it's not your parents, if you don't know how are you supposed to do any better? Mary Holland J.D. 39:57 There are people and As you know, DD not every physician knows they should, but not every physician really understand how toxic the shots are they were taught that they're safe and effective. So yes, there are people who are culpable, and they need to be held accountable. But many people are just doing the best they know how to do. And that's how a system works. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 40:21 It does. So thank you so much, I can't talk to you forever, I'm going to have to come and visit you and just sit in your living room and half a million questions. Thank you for joining me, and thank you for everything that you do, and not very much appreciated. Mary Holland J.D. 40:37 Thank you. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 40:38 I really enjoyed my interview today with Mary Holland. I got to meet her at the conference that we talked about during our interview in Savannah. And the importance of those conferences, like she mentioned, is being able to be around people who are like minded, but also very diverse. There were doctors, there were lawyers, there were parents that were people who were questioning things, there were people who are supporting things, so many different people talking about so many different things that are very important to our children's health, and our well being for medical freedom. So in the interview, when we talk, one of the things that I realized was how involved people like Mary Holland are in CHD. TV, and in their program. It's not it's international, and it's so exciting. And I pay a lot of people asked me, How do I get involved? How do I do what Mary Hollins doing? I want to speak up, I want to talk more, I want to ask more questions. The conferences like the one at CH, D are everywhere. There's all kinds of opportunities. Most states have medical freedom groups. Most states have conferences, a lot of different programs. And here on our show, we'll put up some of those sites and links so that you can go and check them out, find something near you. You can always reach out to us at our show, and ask more questions. And we'll always do our best to link you to opportunities in your area. But the biggest thing is knowing that you're not alone. And that's something that's really important is that there are ways to get involved. There's ways to show your support. But there's also ways to learn more. The thing that I enjoyed the most talking about Mary, talking with Mary Holland, was her passion for what she does, and that she hasn't given up. And most of these people like her have their own stories about their own children who have been affected by vaccines, on know so many people with COVID that have lost their lives due to the vaccine. When they're in that world. It's hard. It's hard to stay on top of it. It's hard to stay positive and integrated into what they're doing. But she does and she does it fantastically. Being at the CHD conference in Savannah, this last year in November was really important to me. And it showed me a lot. Dr. Paul, and I speak at these conferences, and being able to do so and share with other people what we know, share the things we've learned. It's really important. And I also want to say thank you for watching our show. Thank you for sharing our show, we got to watch what we did at the conference on a CHD. TV episode that just recently aired. And it was incredible. We'll also put the link up for that. When you see what we do and how we talk and why it's important to stand up for what you believe in. I think it makes it a little easier for us to go Yeah, I can do that. I can join in, I can speak I can start a moms group. I can start something in my community. Don't ever worry about stepping up and stepping out. Sometimes standing up for yourself and standing up for others. Sometimes it means standing alone. And that's okay, because you're never really alone. Thanks for watching everybody, it's me Diddy coming to you from my soul. Today I want to share how I feel about connection, spiritual connection to be exact. So when we talk to people and we interact with people, we have sometimes we're emotional. Sometimes it's educational. Sometimes it's just hanging out with friends. But no matter what, whoever we're with whatever we're doing, there's a way we connect to each other. The way we bond the way we interact spiritually. That's when we're interacting, being talking From a place from love. So for me spiritual connection is really taking a deep breath sometimes and listening to the other person, not waiting to speak, not waiting to just tell them how you feel, but really listening, seeing how is it that they feel and being spiritually connected and for me means that I really take the time to look inside of myself and see how I'm feeling. What can I offer? How can I be the most loving person that I can? That to me is being spiritually connected. Thanks for watching. Dr. Paul 45:45 I look forward to running together with the wind at our backs, revealing the science that gives clarity in our world. It's full of propaganda and misinformation. Visit our website, doctors and science.com Sign up. Donate if you can. Your support makes a difference. And let's make this the weekly show the world has been waiting for. Thanks for watching. I'm Dr. Paul. Transcribed by https://otter.ai PDF:TEXT:Dr. Paul 0:07
Dr. Paul Welcome to with the wind science revealed. My guest today is OB GYN, Dr. Nathan Riley as a young OB GYN he has made the transition from the medical model that most other doctors are practicing in to supporting midwives and home births. He's got a midwife collaboration program. He's got a Born Free method, a holistic approach to HPV and preventing cancer. And the shocking thing to me was when C section rates and hospitals are running 30 to 40%, he still deals with high risk pregnancies and has a home birth C section rate of less than 5%. It's crazy impressive. Now, the ending DD Hoover does a masterful job of playing devil's advocate, and then getting into some really controversial topics, you're not gonna want to miss it. Enjoy the show. Dr. Paul, coming to you from the heart. My topic today is gratitude. But it's a specific gratitude. I want to thank all of you who are speaking truth to power. Thank you, for those of you who are standing up for people who have no sense of power, who have no hope. You know, so many of you are risking your careers, even relationships to do what's right. And we need more of that. So I applaud and encourage all of us to stand for what we know needs to be done in our world today. You know, peaceful disobedience. Sometimes it's necessary. And I think it's important, especially in everything we've seen happen in the last few years. So I am in gratitude to all of you, we need to continue to have compassion for people who feel differently. People who disagree with us, people who maybe are even what we would consider our enemies. But let's lead with love. We certainly have endless opportunities for forgiveness. But I feel a shift is coming. So let's stay strong. In what we're doing. Welcome, Dr. Nathan Riley, it is such a privilege to have you back on the show. Dr. Dr. Nathan Riley 2:26 Thomas, it's always a pleasure to meet another person who's not just out there like self promoting, but is actually reading literature and still in helping to try to navigate this whole informed consent thing. Like it's really, I feel so refreshed, just having spent some time with you earlier today. It's just, it's an honor. So I'm happy that we get to spend more time together. Dr. Paul 2:46 Yeah, the feeling's mutual, you are a rare, indeed, breed of an OBGYN. You're board certified in that specialty, which is the group of doctors who take care of pregnant women, right? And female issues. A you're a co creator of the Born Free method and clear and free your holistic solution to persistent HPV, which we're going to talk about before we're done. But I wanted to start with because not everybody necessarily knows your story. How the heck does a OBGYN get disillusioned with traditional care? And start doing all these incredible innovative things you're doing? What's your journey there? Dr. Nathan Riley 3:26 I probably get a different answer to this all the time. And I don't want to be disparaging to people who are still inclined to go to the hospitals and clinics. But for me personally, as a man as like a lifelong student, I just found I wasn't getting support from people that were training me or that my colleagues and whatnot for just asking questions and wanting to investigate those answers and be willing to be wrong. Nobody really out there likes being wrong. I've been wrong about like 90% of the things that I've conjecture, but I've also been right about 10%. And those 10% have not only gotten me in trouble, but they've also been the sort of seeds that have grown into these really extraordinary conversations I've had with people who have felt let down by the system. So I'm serving a minority. But that minority is really I think growing and blossoming into a large minority and perhaps will eventually be the majority and that really sunrays people that I think have become disillusioned with this sort of illusion of safety that's been offered by the medical establishment, the medical industrial complex, and I still think there's good reasons to go to the hospital and sometimes get C sections and whatnot. But like, a lot of people are being broken by that system. So I didn't take an oath to perpetuate a broken system. I took an oath to take care of people and that's what I do now. Yeah, Dr. Paul 4:42 that's awesome. So when you went to medical school, did you have any idea your career would take this trajectory? Hell no. Dr. Nathan Riley 4:50 I was I thought I'd have a 401k and I'd be making several $100,000 per year and driving an Audi and whatnot. And granted I'm not like hurting financially but I don't live in California. are nowhere the cost of living is extraordinarily high. I live in Kentucky and we have two little girls the second was born at home and I work with midwives. Now I'm like a student of midwifery now. So yeah, I did not. That's where my career was gonna go. That's for sure that Dr. Paul 5:14 that is just amazing. And so you're in your let's just go back to your in your OB GYN residency, I remember rubbing elbows with the OB GYN residents, because as a pediatrician, or in the delivery, you guys are cutting the babies out and handing them off to us. And we're writing them off and occasionally giving them oxygen, whatever we had to do. The system that we were trained in, was all we knew. How did you end up waking up to the fact that maybe there's a better way or a different way that seems to have what kind of health outcomes are you seeing? Dr. Nathan Riley 5:48 It pretty simple. I started listening, started listening to people and women who had let's say, I'll go back to my medical school training. I had a really great attending. I did an OB anesthesiology, rotation for whatever God and if for whatever reason, and I think part of it was like, Oh, maybe I want to play epidurals and spinals there are in certain parts of the world OB Joanne's can do that you have the skills to do it, you just haven't trained to do it. So let me go and do that. I realized man, these are like the ultimate customer service agents. And there was a there was a an attending I had who's remained good friends of mine, she now has a trauma informed, completely free prenatal practice up in Pittsburgh, her name is Tracy Vogel, and she still works as an OB anesthesiologist. But she shared so many stories with me when I was rotating with her about women who had like, natural, physiologic births, what you're thinking of what people were listening or thinking of. And they've still felt like something wasn't right. And I found that to be so interesting was like, what could you possibly complain about you have a healthy mom healthy baby. And when you start to unpack that, you realize the way that we speak to people, the way that we that we honor the experience that is actually everything. And as if now Father, I realized that the way that a doctor speaks to me or touches my daughter, or makes me feel like they're actually seeing me as a person, I am not a dumb guy. I'm not the smartest guy. But I'm not like a total idiot, either. The way that they spoke to me that the way that they made me feel seen and heard was actually everything. And I realized that women in the hospital system giving birth, were not feeling seen, they were not feeling like they were being given a real fair shake and informed consent, they were having information withheld, so that they could stay on medical train, and the doctors and the nurses and whoever all good people with good intentions, could continue doing things the way that they were doing it. Oftentimes, I think at the cost of persons fully embodied birth experience, which I don't see a medical procedure, I see it as a very sacred transformation. I've gone through the birth of my own children. That is a really intensely exciting and also oftentimes very scary experience. I didn't feel like I was prepared with those tools. And by listening to women and their partners and their families, I realized I got to do things differently, because I can't continue to do it this way. Even though the stats would tell you it's safe and all this other stuff. They're saying I didn't feel safe. So what is that unpacking that and listening to people is really I think, where I started getting nudged out, I saw myself out it was like maybe I just don't belong here. Dr. Paul 8:22 So then, how long have you been doing home births or supporting midwives who are doing home births. Dr. Nathan Riley 8:30 About five years now, for for only four years actually, I practiced in Encinitas and Adonis scripts. While I was in fellowship for hospice and palliative care. I'm actually dual board certified. And while I was in hospice fellowship training, I was working as a full time OB GYN in a Scripps hospital doing all of this stuff as a hospitalist meaning I was there to do all the emergency things whenever their doctors weren't available to come in. And, and lab, it was a really great place. Lots of C sections, lots of like, really emergency kind of stuff. And then when I got recruited out to Kentucky, it was about six months into my tenure there. And I was like, I can't do this. There's people calling me in to help with C sections, and they want to talk about their kids basketball games, and they wanted me to go to stuff and I'm like, this is a person who's going through the the most nightmarish thing of their life and emergency C section. And we're just going to like casually just babble about whatever small talk. So I call the call it quits there and immediately found myself in a space where I could either start a homebirth practice myself, or if I really believe in withevery, I read midwives. And that's when I started collaborating with midwives around the country. And then that led me naturally into home birth, because there's a lot of midwives who can't practice based on licensing restrictions and whatnot, they can't see certain people. And then those people, their only option is to go to the hospital. If we can pay attention to certain things and we can dial in your lifestyle, maybe detox before your pregnancy, all those types of things. You don't have to worry about those pregnancy complications, but nobody's doing The network. So I find myself in this kind of strange niche taking care of high risk people from their past pregnancies and helping them have their dream birth in a current pregnancy. Dr. Paul 10:07 Wow. You've probably helped hundreds already. Dr. Nathan Riley 10:13 Yeah, it was like 1000 plus first when I finished my my year down in Encinitas. And now if you were to if you were to take the births, I've gone to myself, and the number of women I've supported in pregnancy buy in, by means of supporting their midwife, it's probably been 1000s It's the most rewarding sort of path I could have found myself on. Dr. Paul 10:33 You are a blessing to to the whole birth industry. Yeah, it takes real guts to have the extensive training that you've had. And I would also add maybe indoctrination. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Then be able to break away and support midwives. What a blessing. I remember when my mom was a nurse midwife in the Ohio Valley, and she was training, she was a certified nurse midwife from Yale, training lay midwives so that they would recognize high risk situations. Wow. Cool. And they could not find OBGYN to support them. Yeah, yeah, Dr. Nathan Riley 11:08 that's I think that's a national growing problem. Nationally, there's a lot of states where was they could have attended 10,000 birst. They cannot practice midwifery. Without a quote, collaborative physician or a supervising physician as if I this like young guy, who trained in the medical system has any has any real insights into what's going on in our hospital birth, this is apples and oranges. Fortunately, I straddle those two worlds, and I've been able to support midwives and keep them in practice, and not make the money. I'm not charging the homebirth fees that a lot of people do when I do go to homebirths. Yeah, there's a fear but, but instead of hiring me, let me just support your midwife so they can take care of you at one time. So it was more of a It's not self selfless. It's more just Lin if we want to have the most impact. Where who is doing the best birth work? It's midwives. Yeah. So let's put our resources towards that. I'd like the whole country to do that. But for now, I'm like, an n of one who's supporting midwives. And now 24 states. I've got 24 medical licenses. It's a lot. Dr. Paul 12:16 Yeah, so I know your website's beloved holistics.com. And they can click on a link there for midwife collaboration program. Yeah. And of course, your podcast, which was just on your podcast. It's an amazing podcast. Thank you. I had an interesting question. I didn't warn you about this one. But it just popped in my head. Having been on your podcast, what have you learned from others in your podcast that just stand out? Wow. Dr. Nathan Riley 12:44 No, I, the joy of having a podcast is I can bring in people that are relative. I don't know what the word expert means anymore. But there are people that have been so deeply thoughtful and committed to certain trying to understand certain things about the human experience that is so relevant to birth work, for example, like intimacy between let's just like a male and a female, like a heterosexual relationship. The opportunity that men are seeking now to be a part of this experience are really show up in a very different form of masculinity, compared to what we maybe what our fathers, our brothers, our frat fraternity brothers, whatever was modeled to us, that doesn't really serve us nowadays. If you want to be fully invested in this birth process, I get the opportunity to bring people on that are experts in Tantra. They're experts in the sort of work of David data of divine masculinity, divine femininity, it really helps it put together the whole story of the human experience, as opposed to looking at ourselves as this automated, robotic kind of automobile. The best, the greatest insights that I've gained are actually things that I've liked John Weinland, was a guest recently and read his book and like my sex life with my wife started getting better, like these little bits of information that are there less about this sort of linear process of what you do in life and more about actually embracing presence, and community and connection with the people we love the most, including my own little girls. It's a joy to have a podcast like that you can just have these conversations that were either genuinely curious, and then we can unpack it in conversation or kind of a flow. That's I think that's probably the the greatest insights that I've gained from guests on my podcast. Dr. Paul 14:30 Wow. Dr. Nathan Riley 14:30 What about you? I'm curious. Dr. Paul 14:32 I sure I could go there. Let me finish this thought though. Okay. Well, I was visiting with my daughter just this last week, and she's eight months pregnant, and she's gonna do a home birth, and she has a midwife support but that's it. She doesn't have you in the background. So I'm really glad to know about you. And I'm going to tell her about you but never mind. I'm having this conversation with her husband. And he made the comment this childbirth at home stuff. I'm just gonna be in the background. I'll bring the hot water and I'll serve coffee. And then I'm listening to your description of being in touch with your soul and the purpose of connecting that. And thinking, Okay, I need to send him to your podcast. Yeah, I Dr. Nathan Riley 15:12 do as much counseling of soon to be fathers as I do pregnant women nowadays because Yeah, listen, the pregnancy thing is actually the easy part. What's going to come for the next 18 years raising this little child? That's really what that's the hard part of having a baby, I Dr. Paul 15:26 think. Yeah, no, absolutely. And navigating all these tough decisions, which I know both of us handle on our podcast. So yeah, to flip it back on myself, you're asking me what I've learned. I'll say it for COVID. Especially, because I was pretty versed in pediatrics. That was my wheelhouse. And then comes COVID is what the heck is this? First of all, it just descends upon us. And we're all like scrambling to try to figure it out. And I've since had countless amazing people, Peter McCullough, Pierre Corey, and countless others who are really on the cutting edge of yeah, not only did they figure it out, but they're speaking up standing strong when they're being censored. Yeah, Dr. Nathan Riley 16:14 yeah. And who else is gonna give them that platform? Like nowadays, the media at large is not really interested in those conversations. But we get to just do this and get learn from one another. And at the end of the day, you're just a person, I'm just a person. And every single day, I have to figure out where do I put my attention? Oh, Paul Thomas was just on my podcast. And he said something that stuck with me. And that's like, a different path for me to go down. And that's, that's really, I think, how we're going to evolve medicine. That's where we're going to really move our society in the right direction is having honest conversations with people that are willing to just say, I don't know, what do you think that's really I think what Miss and that's what drew me into medicine in the first place is having that collegiality? I don't have that in my life right now. Dr. Paul 16:54 Yeah, no, it's so true. I'm really grateful for your podcast. I imagine you've covered COVID and masks a bit on your show. Dr. Nathan Riley 17:02 Oh, yeah. James Thorpe, who's an OBGYN MFM, Florida. He was on the podcast recently. Yeah, all of those things have actually become a big part of unfortunately, as become a sort of the forefront of my whole practice. Because let's take the farm, for example. animes sort of legacy in Summertown, Tennessee, the farm midwifery practice used to attract people from around the world to have a really unusual birth experience on this farm, this commune in Tennessee, but then COVID happened in midwives shit the bed more than anybody. Suddenly they like, succumb to this fear. And now you had to have a mask on and you have to be double or triple boosted and all this stuff. And I'm speaking as a peripheral observer, right? Some of these birth centers that were radically different, they just succumb to this notion that you have to have a mask on while you're giving birth and all this and a lot of women were like, No, my wife included, we're having a home birth, because I'm not wearing a mask and pushing my baby out. I'm not going to do that. I'm not gonna shove a stick up my nose, while I'm actively laboring like, right, it's just not going to happen. So we've had a lot of conversations like that. And Dr. Paul 18:09 your observation is, since you've been open minded about the fact that maybe those masks weren't really doing much, you've probably had plenty of exposure, the last two, three years of home, childbirth done, unmasked. And how did everything how did it go? Were they putting themselves at risk? Dr. Nathan Riley 18:28 I think that there's two elements to this. And we talked a little bit about this on my podcast when you were on recently. The first is that people who succumb to this fear and that there's some sort of external device that's going to save them, they actually end up using that as a surrogate for living healthy lives. The people that are walking around with no vaccines, no masks, and they're not getting sick, their families not getting sick, and when it's because they're actually probably living a healthy life. But the second part of it is that when as soon as you succumb to fear, you're going to show up, in a way in childbirth or otherwise, that reflects a world that is scary, that you're going to get hurt. And all that like that becomes your reality, like your world does become scarier. And we could talk about the neuro chemistry of fear and how it suppresses the immune system and polyvagal theory and all of this. But truthfully, the people that are birthing with me and a lot of my colleagues, including Sarah Rosser, who's one of the most incredible midwives I've ever worked with, they're healthy people, and they're just not willing to play the fear game. They're like, Yeah, this is an exciting thing. And I'm not going to go through this already very exciting thing is sometimes scary thing, childbirth, and simultaneously be afraid I'm going to get sick or whatever else. I'm just not going to play into that. And that actually, I think is reflected in some of our statistics and my low C section rates and everything else fears pickle. Dr. Paul 19:49 Yeah, actually, you've got to share your C section rate because I learned it on when I was on your podcast, but you are dealing actually with a lot of high risk pregnancies in the sense that they've had other problems in the past with past pregnancies that almost any other OB GYN would say, is a requirement to deliver in the hospital. Yet you're supporting people to have these subsequent births at home. And what's your C section rate been? Dr. Nathan Riley 20:16 Four to 5%? Consistently? Wow. systole? Yeah, yeah. And they are not low risk. These are higher risk women. Yeah. Yeah, Dr. Paul 20:25 that blows my mind. Because there are big downsides to having a C section for both the baby and the mom. Yeah. And so instead of a 30 40% C section rate had these high risk pregnancies gone to the hospital, you're at less than 5%. What a gift you giving these families? And sure I'm some of those 5% that end up in the hospital. I imagine it's a bit of a scramble, but I'm sure they have a contingency plan. So they do. Okay. A big part of it is setting some very clear expectations, right? Listen, Dr. Nathan Riley 20:59 I can't promise anything, I'm not going to guarantee anything. In fact, even a baby that comes by C section in the hospital, healthy mom healthy baby means nothing to me. Because like you said, our composite scores generally don't take into account the less the non measurable things, the mental, emotional, even spiritual aspects of this process. Which is why when I was telling you that in the hospital, just having a breathing and Linkbait afterwards, not everything for people, but also we do so much preparation, way in advance even before they get pregnant. We do some we look, we look at phase one and phase two metabolism in the liver. Have we detoxified from you from all this other job? Are you eating organic food? Are you eating nutritious foods? Are you moving adequately? Are you hydrating? Well with living water, not like crappy water from your sink? Are you sleeping well, their adrenals in order like How was your emotional boundaries, we get all of that in order and it no surprise then that they have a lower risk of these pregnancy complications arising and subsequent pregnancies. It's what can we do to avoid those things that you've been told are inevitable? And it turns out, there's a lot in people's control. And I don't think a lot of doctors are trained on how to do a variety of those things. So I have this kind of magic combination of things that gets people to where they want to go. Dr. Paul 22:15 Yeah, I imagine this is incorporated in your Born Free method. This is the whole Dr. Nathan Riley 22:21 thing. I don't have enough time in my days to take everybody one on one. So I say join the community. We're in free method. It teaches you everything, including vaccines and ultrasounds and all these other things that are controversial, or at least growing in controversy. For some people, we cover everything, including all the lifestyle stuff that you can use right now to avoid that, and I become like your concierge guy, but I can't do it one on one with every single person that comes to me. So we built the program, and it's going really well. So Dr. Paul 22:49 fantastic. Thank you for doing that. That's, that's the direction I'm going as well. We need to reach more people. So yeah, absolutely great that you've done that. Let's pivot a little bit to your HPV program. You've got a free holistic solution to persistent HPV. And I think you have some pretty strong thoughts about cancer screening and prevention and mitigation of abnormal results. What can you share? So Dr. Nathan Riley 23:12 we've got about 14 million per year, people per year diagnosed with HPV in our country alone, but 80 million people are living with it. So let's pause there. Those are big numbers, right? The issue though that I have with it is number one, viruses are not living things are not out to get us all these vaccines that you and I have shot the breeze over? Do you really need to be vaccinated against every possible virus? Probably not. I think most people are going to be do just fine. And if you're not doing just fine, like human papilloma virus, a little tiny strand of DNA, just floating around in a viral protein capsule. If you get that, and your body is not able to kick it, or what I say is integrate it and there's a signal there. What is the signal there's something going on with your immune system. And furthermore, your immune system is also responsible through NK cells and other T cells to scavenge precancerous cells. You and I both have cancer cells, but we have a strong immune system that goes around and says, Nope, you're not you don't belong Nope, you don't belong. The macrophages spit them out and you're fine. What happens the OBGYN clinics that this is what I was trained to do was that people arrive they get their routine Pap smear, something's abnormal, or the HPV screen is positive, it's abnormal. So you end up coming back in six to 12 months and we're hoping and praying that it's not abnormal anymore. The OB GYN are not giving women or their partners for that matter, any tools in order to take this signal as an opportunity to get something in their lifestyle, better in order. So in that six to 12 months, by the way, Paul HPV transmission to abnormal cells showing up months to years, and then from that, what we call cervical intraepithelial neoplasia cin. When that progresses for a tip progressed to invasive cancer years, two decades, and yet nobody in these clinics and these multiple visits, the biopsies, the excisional procedures, nobody's giving you any tools in order to help get whatever's upstream, back in order so that this is not an issue for you for the rest of your life. Yeah, so. So anyways, the immune system just boosts the immune system, right. So Dr. Paul 25:24 boosts the immune system. Yeah. Dr. Nathan Riley 25:26 But what your OB GYN will offer you instead of telling you, Hey, listen, it's a 90% chance this is gonna go away on its own, and we can boosts that dramatically, almost to 100%. I'm not going to say 100% Because that's not fair. But almost not 100% If we can get your diet and your movement, your sleep and all those things in order. So even if you do develop abnormal cells, that sin three, that's the next step before invasive cancer 50% is going to regress on its own. So all we have to do is say Okay, listen, there is a risk here. But what can we do what's in your control? The OBGYN nurse practitioners and midwives. I'm doing that so now I have to do that. It's another thing that it's she's Oh, man. Now I have to do this. Take this whole approach like I did with pregnancy and childbirth, and I have to do the unpopular thing. But women are clearing HPV they're clearing their cervical dysplasia, and it's not rocket science. It's just very basic things. Yeah, that's exciting. I remember reading a paper some years back on HPV vaccine. It was in JAMA, and it was claiming that it was reducing cancer and I, as I read through the data carefully, the rates of sin three, which is the most closest to actual cancer had gone up in the vaccinated, let's talk about it. But the abstract and the title suggested that the HPV vaccine was reducing your risk. So what's your take on the HPV vaccine at this point? So what you just described was negative equity efficacy. Let's get we'll get there in 60 seconds. Let's first start by looking at our favorite pharmaceutical company. Merck, who in the early 2000s, was facing 10s of millions of dollars in lawsuits due to Vioxx. Vioxx was causing heart attacks. It's an NSAID, like ibuprofen, was causing all these issues. They were hit with tons of lawsuits, they were gonna go bankrupt through a Hail Mary, and created an entire PR campaign around preventing cervical cancer, and they launched their Gardasil vaccine, which is now called Gardasil nine. There are three variations of cervical cancer vaccines, if you want to call them that. The third Gardasil nine is the currently the only one available market in the United States. It was advertised through the be one less campaign, this is in the early 2000s. I think 2006 is when Gardasil nine was released, if I recall, it was advertised as a means of preventing cervical cancer. The problem is, for the reasons I mentioned, cervical cancer takes years two decades to develop. So we can't measure that as the primary endpoint in our studies. So what they did was using some less than honest placebo controlled trials, I'm using air quotes on my end is that they use to send to incent three as the surrogate markers because those hand progressed to cervical cancer, even though a big portion of those will regress on their own even without my help. The problem here is that it had been since parents had become so conditioned through this be one less campaign to think that they were being irresponsible for not vaccinating their children, which by the way, this is offered as early as age nine, before you become sexually active to boys and girls, my little girls are going to be offered this as well as a means of preventing cervical cancer, but it was never demonstrated to prevent cervical cancer. And when you've been exposed to the high risk strains of HPV 16 and 18, in particular, and you get the vaccine, they saw that these women were more likely to develop sin to incent three after they had been after the vaccine had been administered. Once they'd already been exposed to 16 and 18. So one way to look at that is the vaccine caused the cancer. I do think that vaccines certainly dis regulate the immune system. I don't think it's fair to say it caused it any more than cigarettes cause cancer or lung cancer because not everybody who smokes gets lung cancer. Not everybody who got this vaccine got cervical cancer, but there's definitely there's definitely something there to explore. And the unwillingness of our medical system to explore this and ask the questions is what has led so many women to be feel completely powerless and really not just powerless, but they're succumbing to this fear that once they get that positive HPV screen that it's doomsday around the corner, and that's just simply not the case. Yeah. Unknown Speaker 29:33 So you might have answered this and I missed it. But what do you tell those women who've gotten the HPV vaccine? And now they're worried or is there something they can do? Dr. Nathan Riley 29:48 Similarly to all the hepatitis B, for example, like all these other vaccines that we're giving kids, I say, great, you got the vaccine. I don't really care if you got the vaccine. I don't think that it protects you. I don't think it's necessarily in Eisah Leyshon outside of the 72 dose 72 dose vaccine schedule. I don't think in isolation, it's the end of the world plus, we can't unvaccinated you. So let's let the you know, bygones be bygones. Let's worry about everything that is in your power in order to make sure that your immune system, your nervous system, your endocrine systems, all those systems are working in your biodynamic being in order to make sure that you're not predisposed to some serious infection or consequence that infection in the future and this goes to Coronavirus, flu anything like there's no, there's no reason, Paul for us to be afraid of viruses, they outnumber bacteria 10 to one, at least in nature. So if we if viruses are out to get us, we're all doomed because they're everywhere. They're all over us. So what can we do if we're not looking at diet and our clean water, air and soil if we're not sleeping? Well, if we're not setting emotional boundaries, not managing stress? Yeah, you could get sick and die from a viral infection. That's a real shame because we've got so much money and resources in our country. And the best the OBGYN is can do is say, Oh, come back in six to 12 months, we'll repeat the screen. And hey, if it's still positive, we might need to take a painful biopsy, no anesthesia for that. That's this colposcopy with biopsy. And then if you end up in excisional procedure, we're lopping the top of your cervix off. There's all sorts of issues with that that's an erogenous zone. That's one of your sexual organs. It has pregnancy implications, all sorts of things. So my whole thing is, Listen, don't be afraid. What is in your control? Let's work on those things that are in your control. Wow. Dr. Paul 31:33 I was gonna ask you what is the most important thing you want people to remember? I think you just answered it. That's it, right? This is amazing so people can reach you. Find you at beloved holistics.com You can forward slash podcast to get to the podcast, you can click on the midwifery collaboration program. You're born free method. This HPV information. Impressive. Don't leave folks. I'm going to have Didi Hoover. Talk with Dr. Nathan Riley. On a personal level. She has that knack for just getting real. You guys have fun. Wait. Thanks, Paul. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 32:09 Thank you, Dr. Nathan for joining me and being willing to be put through the DD interview. Oh, yeah, mom. So I had to tell you I was listening to your your episode that you did with Dr. Paul on your show. And you play devil's advocate and then he played devil's advocate. You froze her terrible about at Devil's advocate. So let me show you how devil's advocate is supposed to be played. Are you ready? Sure. Okay. Dr. Riley, it is so much better for the baby to get vaccinated through the mom. And because of that way, if the mom catches these diseases, then the baby is protected. Also, what if the mom were to get hurt the mom catches the diseases not only the baby protected but the the moms protected because I'm serious. Think about this. Dr. Riley? If mom are to get polio, when she's pregnant with the baby, she could die and then the baby would die. Do you understand that? Why do you not recommend shots during pregnancy? I think that's insane that you don't that's how you play devil's advocate. By the way. That's Dr. Nathan Riley 33:23 good. That's nice. I like that you set me up. That's a softball though. You gotta we're playing in the big leagues, and I'm just kidding. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 33:31 At Yeah, I think that's pretty big league with what's going Unknown Speaker 33:33 on in the world? Yeah, no. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 33:35 Okay, how about COVID? I shut that COVID Dang it. I want Dr. Nathan Riley 33:39 to reiterate this whole fear around viruses, right most of the things that we're vaccinating against that we're trying to get an immune response towards to protect us or against viruses which outnumber bacteria 10 to one. If viruses are the bad guys, then we are doomed. There's no amount of vaccines that are going to protect us because the Coronavirus the SARS cov. Two that big name SARS cov. Two reflects a specific strain of Coronavirus, which is why a flu vaccines don't work that well, which is why the COVID shots aren't going to work that well. And so if we're thinking about vaccinating a pregnant woman, and we're really concerned about our health, if that's our if that's our motivation, why are we doing more in order to support their health through systemic change, radical reform and how we feed ourselves, the nutritious the available of nutritious food? If we're really concerned about viral infection, and viruses are going to win if they're bad guys, they're always going to win. The inability for us to just take the information from this little nucleic acid strip this little microscopic, like electro microscopic, like these are little fragments of stuff. If that's the big concern, why are we investing as much as we can into helping pregnant women be as healthy as possible, from the moment that they get that positive pregnancy test. That's my actual life. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 35:05 And even before that, I think that's the Yeah. Anybody have your and we talk about that with our nutritional stuff. But my what I want you to explain to a lot of people now right now is telling me what why are these shots dangerous during pregnancy? Dr. Nathan Riley 35:22 I don't think that they're resulting in a healthier immune response. So it's not so much that I don't believe that vaccine that the technology is beautiful and elegant and important. I think it's really awesome that we have this idea that what we're injecting is not just promoting an immune response against scary pertussis or whatever else. It's also putting in a bunch of toxic stuff into a pregnant woman. And it's, I think, perpetuating fear, which is going to do you no good as you approach pregnancy or childbirth. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 35:55 Right. But if you get this shot, um, if, again, devil's advocate, if the mom is getting the shot, why would it affect the baby? Dr. Nathan Riley 36:05 Why would because everything that mom is being exposed to is going to the baby. So when we when I talk about what type of food you're eating, it's the same conversation as what's going into your body through injectables. You could make the same argument around variety of other injectable things like Vitamin K is a great example that's in the baby, of course. But what are we really trying to do with this? And is the benefit outweighing the harm? I don't really think that we don't get to that one yet. We DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 36:32 have that one up coming. Okay. So whatever you're Dr. Nathan Riley 36:35 putting into the Mama's going to the baby and these babies through, you could look at it through epigenetics, you could look at it through a variety of other factors. Whatever is going into your body, whether it's injected or it's consumed orally or put on your skin, or it's in your cookware or whatever else, it's going to the baby gotta treat our babies our wounds like temples, and that's just that, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 36:55 it's that's just that. No, you're right. Okay. Unbox kids get sick. Anyway, right of not vaccinating is because vaccines make kids sick, then what's the point, especially when vaccines protect against so many deadly diseases as an OBGYN, here's an opportunity as soon as your baby is born to do the vitamin K shot to do hep B. These are all things that can keep these children from dying and the vitamin K shot Come on, you don't want your baby to bleed to death. So why are you as an OBGYN not recommending those things? Don't you feel like that's unsafe? Dr. Nathan Riley 37:37 I am first and foremost a pretty analytical guy. And when I consider the if we're going to go down the path of I think Vitamin K is a really great example. Because now this is super universal. And I told I talked to Dr. Paul about my experience residency about hepatitis B, and then later looking at the Safety Data myself and being like, Oh, my God, I was right. That's so validating. And I can't believe that we're doing this universally. Vitamin K is a great example. It's not technically a vaccine, but it is injected into the baby. And there's a number of issues there. So the risk of hemolytic disease of the newborn in the developed world, like rich countries, like the United States is somewhere in the range of nine and 100,000, it is extremely low. So if we're promoting the idea that the baby can't stop from bleeding inside the brain without this injectable thing, we have to then consider the harms. What is the harm moments after the baby comes out of the uterus, it's in a it's already in a cacophony of noise in lights, and just it's a scary place, a lot of people wearing masks now and this little baby was just in this warm amniotic universe. And now you're going to inflict pain in the heel. All because there's a risk of nine and 100,000. So my analytical mind says listen to the person who's coming to me to help, the risk of this bad thing happening is 900,000, we can decrease that risk by injecting your baby with this button, potentially there's a harm there because we're telling the baby as soon as they arrive earthside that there's it's an unsafe place. It's a painful place to be or side. So I don't even really care about the potential benefits because the benefit here is extremely small. So even from an analytical standpoint, our risk is very low of this bad thing happening. So the benefit is very low of the presumed whatever mechanism of action of vitamin K. And there's a whole bunch of other things they're very hard to measure, but that we know are important because we listen to women, we listen to their partners, we listen to the babies. And if it's not, if there's not a great benefit, then I need better evidence. The burden of evidence, I think is on those people who want to deviate from nature and there's nothing natural about shooting synthetic vitamin K into a baby's foot. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 39:47 Right. What do you think I'm gonna ask you just because it is something that we've we have recommended in the past and that's the drops the vitamin, vitamin K and Vitamin K drops And yeah, orally if it was, I think the thing that's risky for these moms is that they're told, especially with a C section baby man, there's so risk the babies are being they could have bleeding because of the how violent the birth is are coming down the birth canal and all the different things that could cause the bleeding. So it puts again a state of fear and a mom that Yeah, especially with a C section baby, that that could that could be an issue. And so the drops is this way of saying, okay, maybe if there's an issue, then that's there, do you support drops? Or do you say no vitamin K at all? Dr. Nathan Riley 40:38 I don't have any. So my approach is not to say do this or don't do this. It's to say, Hey, listen, here is what we know from the data. I am not opposed to people wanting to get Vitamin K, as long as they're informed the drops are an alternative. We did that for our first we did not do anything for a second. But what I will also say is that again, back to what I said before, do you think it's impossible to conceive of a healthy diet in a pre pregnancy and during pregnancy, this woman eating vitamin K to rich foods, that it's not going to somehow be translated into a baby that has healthy blood and healthy clotting. Of course, not the same go. This is a fat soluble vitamin. The same goes for breastfeeding. If you have a natural birth, you're eating nutritious foods. And by the way, those would be bone broth, organ meats, fermented cod liver oil, smoked oysters, eggs, if you're taking those five foods, you are going to have absolutely zero issues related to micronutrient deficiencies in glad no one DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 41:38 told me about those foods when I was pregnant. I probably could have done it. But I would have thrown up every time after I'm just kidding. Unknown Speaker 41:44 I agree. It's an acquired taste. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 41:48 And again, there's so many things that we do we want to have healthy babies. So I'm glad you said those things. Here's another one. I heard you say Dr. Nathan that your second child that's unvaccinated and had no nothing interrupted to that precious little body actually is getting more sick more often than your first child who had vaccinations. So if that's the point, should you have vaccinated your child then? And maybe that's because your wife didn't get any shots during her pregnancy? Is that why? Dr. Nathan Riley 42:19 No Dr. Pol actually helped me with this one I had asked him about this before the recording and he was like your toddler is going to preschool in and out and about and bringing home all the germs in order for the firt the second little one now to just be exposed to more things at a more rapid rate. And I'll add that, so we were never leaving the house. And now our little one is out and about and just getting exposed to a lot more. So I actually feel very grateful that Paul told me that because now I'm like, great, she's gonna have a super immune system. When he or she's healthy. She's fine. It's just, she's just been more sniffles than I expected. But I told him I was like, man, is this like, it seems counterintuitive? He was like, no, like, it's just your baby's getting exposed to more things. Okay, no problem. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 43:00 We're finding is good just simply to because and I always tell ask parents when they say that with their toddlers that did or kids who did get vaccinated, they can they get sicker when they're sick, and theirs will last longer. And part of it is not having that immune system that builds up. So what you'll notice is when your second baby is a toddler, they probably won't have some of those same illnesses. Yeah, yeah. That's funny that you even Okay, so I'm done playing devil's advocate. Here we go. If you could go back knowing what you know now, what would you do differently regarding education and career? Would you be a midwife? No, Dr. Nathan Riley 43:41 I'd be like, I'd be in the forest service or something. I'd be like a conservation myself in a space now where I feel obligated to continue doing what I'm doing. But I had no idea that I was going to be so indoctrinated. Like I thought that this was the ultimate foray into the curiosities of the medical sciences. And I've been very much forced pigeon holed in to do it this way or else and I told Dr. Paul when he was on my podcast recently, like I've been challenging kid probably since kindergarten. In fact, they wanted to hold me back in kindergarten because I didn't want to do what the other kids were doing and they thought it was slow. And I was just like, This is too easy. I need to do something else. I've been a problem child I think for most of my life. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 44:25 I wonder if that's why my sister was held back I got the skip kindergarten I guess it's because I was sweet. I wasn't. So honestly, would you if you could do it again and again, have that knowledge would you completely not do a medical career? Dr. Nathan Riley 44:41 It's hard to say that I say everything I said there's a little tongue in cheek i i feel like I'm doing so much good in the world now that I've actually changed my tone when med students or or pre med students reach out and they're asking me about my careers and whatnot. I've spoken at high school career fairs and whatnot. I actually don't tell people to not go into medicine. I just hope that people who do go into medicine are able to maintain their identity. And their sense of curiosity, which has really helped me flourish as a man, as a father, as a husband, as a physician, if I were told that the only way you could do to be an OBGYN is to work in the system that is perpetuating so much obstetric violence and whatnot. If that were the only way forward, then I would say, hell no, this was not for me. But I have found my way. And that's all fine, I wouldn't take it back. Now I'm pretty happy. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 45:30 That leads us into what's the best part of being a dad, are you. Dr. Nathan Riley 45:37 There are very few surprises. Whenever you get to be an adult, when you're a child, you're guided by your impulses. And then when you become an adult, you're guided by your habits. And the whole story of being an adult is trying to develop good habits to release bad habits. So when you have little kids you get, you start to see the world a new one. I know it's cliche, but to be like, inspired again by a bumblebee is actually I think what most of us adults are lacking. It's that play, it's that curiosity and whatnot that was beat out of us through our education, through our careers and all of that. The best part about being a father, too, is to be able to reflect every single day on the amount of love that these little girls feel for me, like I go away on trips, for births or for whatever. And I come back, and they are like, We're inseparable. And that just reminds you to just embrace this present moment right now. And that is like the most the ultimate sort of leveling up. I think when you're an adult, like there's very little new stuff that comes your way, but you get to see the world again, through child's eyes. And that keeps you young, it keeps you optimistic. I'm way more optimistic now. Now that I have kids. And that's awesome. Yeah, what else? What other choice? Do I have? I Oh, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 46:51 you have plenty of choices. But that's a good one darlin. So would you say, then the next question was, what are you best at as a dad? Do you think that's what it is that you're aware of all these things now, that because of what the world has presented, that allows you to be a better dad, because you can be present with your children in the moment that they're in? Because that's what's difficult for most parents. Dr. Nathan Riley 47:16 I think I think the best attribute that I bring to parenting is that whatever it is that they want to do, I want that for them. Because that's what I wanted for my whole life. And I didn't always get that DD. I didn't ever have people, I didn't always have people saying, hey, the way that you are is awesome. And I get to be that for them. So it's a little bit of a projection from my own traumas and whatnot, I can actually start to correct that in my own behaviors for their betterment. And I know that the reason that we're so close is because I just love the fact that they're doing that thing. It's not what I would do, but it's what they're doing. And I can love them through that. And that is probably why I'm doing such a good job. At least I think I am I don't know, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 47:58 Oh, you are and same thing. So then that's also the same thing is What do you think that you're best at which I've already heard, but if you could sum it up as being a doctor, what you're doing and working with midwives and all that, that excites me, that is just incredible. So what do you feel is your best attribute that you offer as a doctor? Dr. Nathan Riley 48:20 When we're like Dr. Paul and I, when we were both any doctor goes through residency years nourished and nurtured to be a part of this bigger system. And I think that what I wasn't incentivized to do was to listen to people, and I find people fascinating. I find a whole human experience to be just this ultimate curiosity. And coming into residency, I had this characterization of midwives as being old, dirty, lazy, stupid, whatever. And then when you actually can just say, but what if that's not true? I always like to look at things from a different perspective, the opposite person's point of view, like what if what I'm being told is not true. As soon as you can do that, it opens up a world of possibilities for you to care for people. So in the, through the lens of just being curious and being willing to listen and see things from another person's point of view. It helps me understand that midwives do this so well. And then furthermore, when I work with midwives, when I work with new clients, just being able to try to empathize and to see a situation from their point of view is has made me such a great physician, a great caretaker, just being present and being willing to see that this person has a whole story that precedes them. They have a whole future ahead. Where do I fit in there? I'm not the captain of this ship. How can I serve this person? Oh DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 49:40 my god. So you just said this. You just said something and I want to point it out because I don't know if you realize this because you're a lot younger than I am. We have to like with pediatricians whenever I would get bullied and whenever doc and I do our thing. I feel like they forget that. That they don't come home with us. They're not our child right? but they are not allowed to make the decisions for us. So you're saying that about the birth experience and for these women who are going through these things, it's about them. It's what they want their work. So when you say that you're not the captain of the ship, and the pediatrician is not the captain of my child ship. So I love that you said that, and that is what makes you great. So I actually had a tough time. But I have a couple things I have, I want to really get to one of them's really important. I work with infants when they're first born, babies are referred to me Doc's been doing that for years. So my body work has to do my pediatric bodywork has to do with that, that birth can be traumatic. I have noticed in my practice, that the most traumatic things to babies with the spine is curved, all those different things. C section is the worse. Yeah. What's funny to me is when there's an emergency birth, that wasn't even planned, where there was no midwife or nothing, that in a home, those babies seem to do the best, the and even in hospital births, long birth, short bursts, certain things affect that baby's body, and colic and all the different issues that we think children have. I think it's birth trauma. Totally. You see the difference in that when you're at these home births and the whole midwife thing? What do you think's the biggest difference? Is it just the light? Is it? What are they doing at home, tell these families who think that home births on safe, tell them why home is better? That Dr. Nathan Riley 51:28 is a great question. You didn't even set me up for this one. And I have been thoughtful about this so much over the past couple of months, actually. So I've started studying polyvagal theory, which is really this theory that it's not just sympathetic versus parasympathetic, you obviously know what this is about, oh, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 51:43 I'm a body worker. So yeah, so without knowing Dr. Nathan Riley 51:47 what some of this stuff seems, it seems, I don't know, it seems to be confronting to what we understand about the nervous system. But if you even look at SIDS, preterm babies now have a higher chance of dying suddenly, in their early years or months of life. I hadn't understood that until I started studying polyvagal. But what's I think most important is even if don't have a preterm baby, the environment outside of the uterus in those weeks to months, up to six months, let's say, after the birth, is a period during which that ventral vagal the I Am, the real full embodiment of the nervous system is starting to be entrained. And you can't do that without co regulation with your mother. When babies are stuck away in the NICU and they're not being held, they're not being there's no mother ease, there's no laying on your bare chest and feeling the pulse and that CO regulation is so critical to to the development of your baby's nervous system into their lifelong health. If you contrast the experience in the home where the baby is coming out, the naked little piglet is covered in goo and is wrapped up and mom is smelling you and she and the baby smelling the mom. And she's speaking soft, whispering loving, caring words and low You're so sweet. Look at your little fingers like all of that for the next six months, helps to develop the baby's nervous systems so that we don't have a sudden collapse in the autonomic drive to stay alive. If, in contrast, that's the home environment, there's no bright lights, there's no loud noises. It's just calm and quiet. And your baby's hearing your thud on your chest, maybe even next to you in bed, like the breastfeeding all of that. Contrast that with the bright lights, they distractions, the sharp needles, that let's put you all a warmer with the bright lights and get you dried off and do all this exams and all this stuff. If you contrast those two experiences, one is in favor of CO regulation, which is actually in support of a healthy philosophy of little human that just came aside. The other is completely detracting from that entire experience. So that little that contrast alone should be enough for us to say the vast majority of births should be taking place in in an environment that looks more like the home environment. Yeah, versus the crazy. That happens in an operating room for 40% of births in the United States. Oh, we can. Sorry. I'm Custer. Sorry, guys. DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 54:19 Yeah. Oh, you have no idea how much I cast. But I've been told I can't on our show. And we edit. So Peter can take out a lot of this. But thank you for saying that you and I are going to have to do another interview on this because that is my work. And it's so important. And I go against what a lot of pediatricians say about having your baby on a firm surface and don't put them in bed with you and don't use something to support if they have toward all those freaking things. I have one more question for you. Dr. Nathan, you being an OBGYN and you said I would like to know about both of your birth your children's birth. So you said the second one was born at home with you? Is it just you or did you have a midwife? Good question. Dr. Nathan Riley 54:56 Very good question, didi. When we went into our first let me start by saying that when we had our first baby, my wife was very healthy uncomplicated pregnancy, but she really wanted to have the baby in the hospital. And it was right before COVID happened. And it's just that was that's what she wanted. I'm always supportive wherever want, somebody feels called to have their baby. And and we had an OBGYN there and it was quiet room. We did our best with that. And Stephanie didn't feel great about the experience. So later, we're in middle of COVID we have our second baby. Now we're going to do it at home. There was the question of do we need to hire anybody because it is expensive. It was like $4,500 out of pocket and I just been fired for taking off my mask during COVID and taking caring for a dying old guy. And so we lost her health insurance. So it was like man, do we somebody can we afford it? Like we just I just lost my income, what are we going to do. And at the end of the day, Stephanie in both pregnancies said, I really want for the first time in your life, for you to just show up as my partner and not be the doctor and not be the guy here to solve problem or save the day. So it actually afforded me the opportunity to step out of the OBGYN shoes and just to be the most conscious husband and soon to be father again, in our second birth. So we did have a midwife there. She brought in midwife, student and she brought a doctor in the community who's getting into homebirth as well. They were all there, but we were doing a type of breathwork called effigy. breathwork. And we started that started that and now it's like a somatic breathwork and crampy and whatnot. But Stephanie and I were laying on the bed the tub was set up our breathwork friend Sara Termoli came and did the breath with us an hour after Stephanie's waters open so an hour into actual labor and 46 minutes into the hour long breasts and the baby was out on her chest like asleep. So yeah, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 56:44 I know that works. Dr. Nathan Riley 56:45 Yeah, it works. That DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 56:47 is such a powerful way to have a baby. Dr. Nathan Riley 56:50 Absolutely. So we had this team there but they didn't have to do anything. It was literally like okay, and had my hands not been cramped up I probably would have caught the baby but I could not use them DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 57:00 so that's so I have to ask just the funny part of it it was Where are you how soon after? Did you go oh my god we didn't even need all these people stuff we could have just done this breathing and having our baby now you've cost me all this money but an hour afterwards Dr. Nathan Riley 57:15 I was like god darn it we Unknown Speaker 57:16 could have just done it my wife not how you're gonna have your third fourth and fifth baby just breathing on the bed. Dr. Nathan Riley 57:22 No we're done having babies present having more join the Clippers I joined clippers we are on a boy I wouldn't mind a boy but I'm not like let's try for another because you know what's gonna happen DD we're gonna you'll Unknown Speaker 57:37 have to you'll actually have girls DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 57:41 in the back, right? Shoot they want to do they wanted a girl they had two more boys. crack me up. Anyway. So yeah, thanks for I think that's important. We always wonder that for a pediatrician. Are you your own kids pediatrician or how? Yeah, so I love that you were there. And you brought up a very good point and that the fathers are very important. So I've been a birth doula and I call it professional labor support for years doing massage through. And I always encourage the dads always seem to be the most grateful about me being there because it assisted them and being the most present they could be. I don't ever think that a doula or anyone should take over the role of the father because this birth, like you said, it's these two people together making this baby happen. Bring this baby into the world. So I love that you you did that. So it's like a great opportunity. Dr. Nathan Riley 58:31 Like I don't want to be that it'd be a doctor to everybody. I can be a dad for this one. That's yeah, DeeDee Hoover LMT, PMT, CCT 58:36 that's your role. So yeah, I think that's incredible. So thank you again for answering my questions. And yeah, you and I'll have to do our own show sometime. Dr. Paul 58:53 I look forward to running together with the wind at our backs, revealing the science that gives clarity in our world that's full of propaganda and misinformation. Visit our website, doctors and science.com Sign up. Donate if you can. Your support makes a difference. And let's make this the weekly show the world has been waiting for. Thanks for watching. I'm Dr. Paul. 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