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​Dr. Paul  0:00  
Dr. Paul, welcome to against the win doctors in science under fire. Our main interview today is with pediatrician, Dr. Dan craft. His topic is truth over fear. I love that. But we're going to talk about censorship and negative propaganda in the medical community, what's happening for doctors, we discuss his background and training and folks, it's powerful. This is a man who could be running the CDC or the NIH right now, incredible background, and he discusses how the pandemic has changed his view about vaccines, certainly with as relates to the COVID vaccine, but starting to actually go, Huh, what's going on with the entire childhood schedule? So we talk about how are we going to reach our peers, other pediatricians, so many of them seem still lost in an old way of thinking. So how did we pediatricians get it so wrong? And for so long? We discussed that and thoughts of where to go from from here. Bernadette closes this out with asking me a question, what's going on in your life? Dr. Paul, you're gonna want to see that. Enjoy the show.

Dr. Paul, coming to you from the heart. My topic today is being at peace. How do we allow ourselves to feel calm and safe in a world that at times just seems so chaotic? Personally, given my own current situation, what's being asked of me, I find it impossible at times to allow myself to stay calm and be at peace, no matter what comes at me. However, that is my goal. That's my desire. And when I get away from fear, and I'm living more in an open state of love and faith, you can be calm in the midst of a storm. And that's something that when you're there, and I get there a little more often than I used to, it's such a cool thing, just to feel at peace and calm no matter what's going on. So it's having that faith over fear that allows me to stay calm, even no matter what's going on. I also have to trust that there is a plan and that I don't necessarily know what that plan is, I have always been a major future tripper, I've got Plan A, B, C, and D. And most of them aren't very good if you really play them all the way through, but that's just the way I was raised. I don't know that's how I was. And from a space of just being calm. Decisions just come to you opportunities unfold. So, you know, rather than trying to think it's about doing and being, it's about being in a calm place, not always being this, I was always a doer, rather than a beer. And so faith wins over fear, folks. And remember this, God does have a plan.

Welcome, Dan crafts, you are such an amazing mentor in the sense that you went before me by a number of years. And I just respect your background and training so much. You had a master's in psychology before medical school, you did a pediatric residency back when I was still in college, you went to John Hopkins School of Public Health that is like the place to go. And we know that in medicine, especially in pediatrics, got your public health degree in international health and maternal and child health. I am in awe of that. And then you are an officer in the US Public Health Service, private practice for I think probably about 35 years there in Florida, it looks like and so welcome to against the wind, it's such a privilege to have you on the show.

Daniel P. Kraft  3:43  
Thanks very much for having me.

Dr. Paul  3:46  
I would be interested. Because you've got such a history in pediatrics, I, I sort of feel like as pediatricians, our role is to be the guardians of children's health, and maybe to usher them through that whole process, right from birth to adulthood. And I feel personally like, somehow things have gone a little astray lately. But I'd like if you wouldn't mind, just start with the important milestones in your life and career as a pediatrician.

Daniel P. Kraft  4:17  
Well, it's funny that you say that you think that we should be the guardians of child children's health. I always feel like we should be the guardians of the whole family because we're the ones who are educating the parents. The I always thought of myself almost as a family practitioner, because we're taking care of parents as much as we're taking care of the kids.

Dr. Paul  4:38  
How did you end up a pediatrician and tell us a little more of your story?

Daniel P. Kraft  4:42  
Well, I I can remember being a four year old, wanting to be a pediatrician because I had I had an uncle who was a pediatrician. And I guess he was my mentor in medicine. And so I remember I As a child, reading all about Albert Schweitzer, and I imagined that I was going to be become the Albert Schweitzer in pediatrics, and I would go off to Africa, and I would save the world's children. So it was when I was in high school, since I knew that I wanted to be a doctor, I wanted to learn as many languages as possible. So I studied French and Spanish in high school and college. And then, when I was in, when I was in medical school, I always gravitated towards pediatrics. I also enjoyed the rotations of Internal Medicine, but I found that the, I found that the the adults were way too complex. And I thought that at least the innocent children, they're starting off with a blank slate. I enjoyed that even more. Plus, I enjoyed the interaction with parents. Yeah,

Dr. Paul  6:04  
that sounds like we share that in common. Your your your training in public health. When you first went into that, that's probably where you were thinking you were going off to Africa to save the world. But how has that affected your understanding of what's going on, through your career, and then maybe talk about transition into COVID. And what's going on these days?

Daniel P. Kraft  6:29  
Well, I look back on my medical training. And I think of the two years that I spent at Johns Hopkins in the School of Public Health as the most interesting part of my career, because you have an ability to look at medicine from a more global perspective. And not to use the word global. To lightly nowadays, it's been corrupted. But I thought of myself, as wanting to understand how medicine fits into the the idea of us being part of the world community, the years that I spent at the Hopkins School of Public Health, learning about epidemiology. And it taught me to be a much more critical thinker, taught me to be able to read studies and understand them much better. So that I wouldn't have to just accept the statistics that the drug salesman or that abstracts would tell me, because most doctors don't have the time. Yeah, to do their own research. And so they rely on the nice looking drug reps that come into your office and try to sell you this and that drug and vaccine. And so, you, many doctors tend to be a little bit lacks when it comes to due diligence. When it comes to using using different medicines or different vaccines.

Dr. Paul  7:58  
So has your you kind of alluded to maybe that your your view of these agencies like the CDC and the FDA, perhaps has changed.

Daniel P. Kraft  8:10  
It's changed drastically because I from even before the pandemic started, I began to see that the CDC was not doing its job. They were not taking a stand on child nutrition. And we found out later in the pandemic, that better nutrition and better supplementation with vitamins might have been helpful to save some of the people who were low, for example, on vitamin D. When the pandemic came along, and they were rushing to provide a vaccine, even before they tested out all of the possibly repurposed medications, they were going whole hog to find an expensive new pharmaceutical product that would be able to solve the world's problems when as far as treating the, the pandemic. So I had my doubts, and I'm involved in in a camera club. And I would would come on to the camera club with all these other seniors in my community. And they were saying, Hey, Doc, did you get your vaccine yet? And I would say to them, You know what, I'm holding off a little bit when it finally comes because I want to be cautious. I want to make sure number one that it's safe. And number two that is effective. And unfortunately, the FDA and the CDC did not convince me at all that the that the vaccine, or different iterations of the vaccine that have come along are either safe or effective. And so I i fault people like Rochelle walensky. I never never heard her mention anything about the about nutrition, how obesity and hypertension and diabetes are are some of the culprits and some of the comorbidities that make survival from from COVID. Much worse. So, I wish that they had done those done those things and not just concentrated so much on on producing and rolling out a vaccine that was really not well tested.

Dr. Paul  10:47  
Yeah. So what are your did? If you don't want to ask this question, feel free? Because it's slightly personal. Did you get the vaccine?

Unknown Speaker  10:54  
No, I did not.

Dr. Paul  10:56  
How have you felt about that decision? In retrospect,

Daniel P. Kraft  11:01  
I'm very happy that I didn't. I believe that there are alternative ways of protecting yourself against COVID. And if I had needed to, I had the proper supplies of some of the generic medicines that I think are working well, not only to prevent, but to treat COVID Extremely well without having to resort to, to any vaccine that I that I think is really dangerous. I have I used to laugh when parents would come in and they would tell me that they're that they were giving their kids lots of supplements. I'm on about nine different supplements myself now. I like Hartley, it's my age. And my wife wants us to stay as healthy as possible. And we we try to eat right, we try to exercise a lot. We tried to stay as balanced mentally as possible. And so we're we're doing well, so far. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to convince any, almost any of my friends or my family members by our three daughters, they've vaccinated themselves. And one of them is even a nurse practitioner. And they vaccinated the grandchildren as well. Much to my dismay, I always have to laugh because there are many, many people who still call me up and ask me advice. I mean, I always they asked me advice on adult medicine. And I always have to tell them, You know what, I'm just a pediatrician. So I don't trust anything that I've said, because I haven't studied adult medicine and 50 years.

Dr. Paul  12:54  
That same line, I'm just a pediatrician,

Daniel P. Kraft  12:57  
right? And my wife hates when I say that. Or she always hates when I say I used to be a pediatrician. My wife always says no, you're still a pediatrician, you might be retired, but especially now that I've been retired, and we're in circles, where people are asking me advice. The people that I love the most and my my closest friends. They're not even, they didn't even ask me anything about the COVID vaccine, even though I was very open from the very beginning, like in our camera club. They were they were clamoring to get the vaccine, they would be saying I want to be the first I want to be I'm going to drive down to Miami, which is two hours away just so I can get my vaccine. I used to say to them, I want to be the 50 Millions person to get it because I want to see lots of studies. I want to see what the post launch marketing studies are in safety studies. And I still I can give. I remember exactly why I was thinking this because I can remember back in the late 1980s When the rotavirus vaccine, the first rotavirus vaccine came out and with an it was tested out in you know, probably 10s of 1000s of patients. They probably did studies in an in third world countries. But they came up with the conclusion that it was perfectly safe. Come to find out when it was launched. Within a couple of months. There were many cases of Intussusception. I think many of your many of the people in your audience know that intussusception, which is where the intestine the small intestine telescope's upon itself and can cause obstruction. And it can be a dangerous problem. And it I don't think that it was usually fatal because most of the kids you can get it reduced. Sometimes it had to be surgically reduced, but there were, there were many cases of it and within maybe In less than 10 cases or less than 20 cases, they pulled the vaccine off the market. And so I mean, you can draw the analogy that when they started hearing about problems that might have been associated with the COVID vaccine, like myocarditis are some of the clotting abnormalities, he would have thought that they would have done that, but they pushed forward and they tried to hide the data on, it's even come to light that they even knew about some of the dangers of these medicines of the vaccine. And that they might have been a little bit more cautious in enrolling the vaccine out until they had a lot more acute accumulation of data.

Dr. Paul  15:53  
Right. So yeah, I totally remember that rotavirus scenario and I'm like, You be Willard, that with the massive amount of data of myocarditis, hospitalizations, harms to children deaths to from the COVID jab. They're still advertising it, they've approved it for kids down to six months, I anticipate it'll be thrown into the childhood schedule as a routine vaccine with boosters required.

Daniel P. Kraft  16:26  
And they're still pushing for people who haven't had any of the vaccines. They're pushing for the original vaccine. For the, for the original vaccine, not right, not this by Valent vaccine that has half of the old stuff and half of the new stuff that's supposed to take care of Omicron. So even though they know that those first two doses of of the vaccine are culprits, and likely to be responsible for all the cases of myocarditis, remember when, before they were giving it to teenagers, even they were saying that young adults were the ones who were having myocarditis. And they were the really well fit athletes and soccer players all over the world who were suddenly having these myocardial

Unknown Speaker  17:22  
accidents. Yeah,

Daniel P. Kraft  17:23  
that word totally coincidental, right.

Dr. Paul  17:27  
Yep. 1000s or 10s of 1000s, maybe hundreds of 1000s of coincidences. What would you say to a parent or a grandparent or a guardian who's hearing all these commercials and messages from public health to get your child vaccinated for COVID this fall? This is the time like the flu shot, we're supposed to do this. What would you say to them?

Daniel P. Kraft  17:48  
There's several groups of people that you have to worry about how they're going to react if we tell them about the dangers, because there's this significant population who themselves have been vaccinated. And so if we start worrying them about the dangers of vaccinating their children, for example, we have to make sure that we're not scaring them half to death. And so many of these people have just not been able to put two and two together, they've not been able to put the puzzle together. I was just talking to a friend last night in Argentina. And he was telling me about a good friend of his that he used to swim with. And these are fit guys who are in their 50s. And he was telling me that this guy is having sudden weakness, irregularities of his heart and vertigo. And so I asked him, Well, do you think that it could be the vaccine. And I've been reluctant to talking to him very much about the vaccine, because I know that he's had four doses of the vaccine. And you always have to be careful, because if you come across a little bit too strong, when talking to people who have been vaccinated, you're really going to be scaring them. So I found that the best way is, first of all, to listen to people to hear if they are having any concerns about it. And so, my my common question that I have to some of these people is, have you heard about any problems that people are having? And then they open up and they say, You know what, I heard about this person I heard about that person I've heard about someone who was in remission from cancer, and all of a sudden now is having problems with cancer and they're hearing the stories. And you do hear about comedians or rappers or different people now who are Suddenly dropping dead. And they're deliberately not saying what their vaccine status is. That is, to me an obvious omission. It isn't so obvious to the general public, because they've done such a great job at denying that there's any connection. I have some friends, who are doctors, very well educated doctors, who themselves had some, what I think are COVID events. And when I suggested to them that this that they should record it to various, they said, Oh, we asked our doctors, and the doctor said, No. And they said, there's no connection, there's nothing, nothing has been proven. And I've had many other people tell me about stories like my friend in Argentina, that they've gone around the block six times with all different kinds of specialists for different ailments that they've had in the past year or year and a half. And not one of them, is asking them if they've been vaccinated. And that's really frightening, that the propaganda campaign is so successful and so widespread, that they're not not doing it. They're not asking those right questions. And so, you know, you, you can't get the answers if you don't ask the right questions.

Dr. Paul  21:27  
Yeah, I read something very recently, California is passing a law, and I think it just may have just been signed, that is going to basically prevent doctors from giving informed consent, or even just having a dialogue about possible risks of COVID vaccines.

Daniel P. Kraft  21:45  
Exactly. And I was the small morning, I was reading about that, because I wondered, it was, as of last night that the governor had a chance to veto it. And in California, they probably would have overridden his veto. But he obviously agreed with this, this campaign to muzzle doctors and just ensure that they that they just go along with the party line. And so it is i It is now a law, or it's going to be a law as of January 1, that doctors are going to be muscled, I don't hear a tremendous outcry from the doctors in California. I can't imagine practicing medicine. I mean, it's bad enough, when the insurance companies would be telling us that we're not allowed to use medicines off label, or we're not allowed to decide which medication we want to give because it's not going to be covered on the formula. i That made me very angry towards the latter years of my practice, that I was being told by an insurance company how to practice medicine. Now it's we're being told by the board's of medicine by the by the insurance companies, by governmental agencies, what we're allowed to say they have unlimited critical thinking at all from from from doctors.

Dr. Paul  23:15  
Yeah. Is that part of why so many of our peers seem to be under a spell and unable to see that there might be a problem with the COVID vaccine, for example?

Daniel P. Kraft  23:28  
I think so. I think that there are a lot of doctors now who are working for hospital corporations. And they, they don't want to lose their their salaries, they don't want to be targeted. They they're being told by whatever organization is in charge of paying them that they have to go along with this. I think that there are a lot of doctors who just weren't doing their due diligence, and they were they were just prescribing it because they believe that the FDA and the CDC, were acting honorably, ya

Dr. Paul  24:08  
know, as you and I both did, back in the day.

Daniel P. Kraft  24:12  
We did and I look back on all those years that I was recommending every single vaccine with, you know, just total trust in the in the CDC or the FDA.

Dr. Paul  24:29  
As your position on the routine childhood schedule changed at all.

Daniel P. Kraft  24:36  
I think that if I were in practice, I would be I would make sure that the parents had a lot more informed, true, informed consent. And I probably would not have been quite as adamant as I was when I was maybe under that same spell.

Dr. Paul  24:55  
So here's a puzzle I've been having and I haven't figured out the solution to it. I've been promoting informed consent. And that's sort of been the bedrock of my stand for pediatrics, just do your absolute best as a pediatrician to give all sides of the information. When it comes to vaccines, yes, some are more beneficial than others, but they all have some benefit. But they also all have some risk, and some are riskier than others, as you and I've been talking, the COVID seems to be the riskiest vaccine, if you, if you will, that we've ever seen. But when I'm giving informed consent, it's only as informed as I am. So when I put when I, when I get out there on my high horse or whatever, and I'm going, we've got to, we've got to do of informed consent, and my peers are going well, that's we do it. You know, here's the video is from the CDC, the Vaccine Information Sheet, I've done my duty. We do we give informed consent. And I'm like thinking, I don't think that's actually adequate. But how do we get around that it's sort of that at the level of the each provider how informed they are,

Daniel P. Kraft  26:07  
most. Most of the time, people don't have the time to read those information sheets. And I think it also is questionable whether there's total truth and transparency in those information sheets. But most of the time, parents used to just trust us. You know, it's the old adage, trust me, I'm a doctor. Yep. And, and parents did have a lot of faith in their doctors, I think it's going to take a long, long time for people to decide for people to trust their doctors, again, I hear it from all the adults that I know that they don't want to be quite dead in the hospital nowadays, because they're afraid what might happen, they're afraid that they might do a COVID test on them that they might, you know, slip some remdesivir. And you know, people don't want to get a transfusion anymore, because they're suspicious of what might be in the transfusions. And so I think that people are downright scared. And it's going to be years before the reputation of doctors is, is rebuilt.

Dr. Paul  27:23  
From your perspective, because you've got a long career of looking at all of this. And like I agree with you, we are our profession has suffered greatly because of our close ties with special interests in pharma and, and our inability to really be accountable for for figuring out what's actually going on. How do we rebuild trust? And is it even possible in this current system? Or do we need to maybe develop a parallel system? I don't know if you've given this any thought.

Daniel P. Kraft  28:01  
I think that a parallel system is in fact, starting right now, right from the very beginning. There are many doctors who are getting out of the the system, there are many nurse practitioners and physician's assistants who are setting up practices where they're able to have total autonomy over their patients, unfortunately, it's going to be like a concierge practice, because many people will not be able to afford this cash only kind of system. So it's, it's going to be it's only going to be a benefit to certain socio economic groups. And so I feel bad that that's going to happen, but I think that a system does have to develop before in order for patients to believe in their doctors again.

Dr. Paul  28:53  
Yeah, I see. I totally agree with you. I see two challenges. One is what you just expressed the insurance companies sort of control things how you practice and if you don't meet their quality measures, then you get kind of off their panel, so to speak that I mean, I've actually

Daniel P. Kraft  29:11  
not only that, but you you get a you get a lower reimbursement if you're not giving the total they've complete panel of childhood vaccines. We all of us pediatricians aimed for that 100% compliance, because we knew that our Medicaid reimbursement was directly affected by that.

Dr. Paul  29:33  
Yeah, thanks for making that point. I wasn't planning to do that. But it's so true folks. We get paid better, the higher the you know, they have these quality measure for how well you vaccinate if you don't reach a certain standard and you take a hit financial hit, and it's fairly substantial. Sometimes the bonuses are huge for doing a good job. So there's that.

Daniel P. Kraft  29:54  
You have to make sure that people understand that it's not a bonus for giving anything bad. It's It's a bonus for, for recommending the full panel of, of childhood vaccines,

Dr. Paul  30:08  
right? Well, more than recommending you have to be successful in your recommendation. So we actually get trained on how to speak to patients, so they'll accept our recommendation. True. Right. Right. You

Daniel P. Kraft  30:25  
know, somebody described all of us pediatricians as the most successful army of vaccine salesmen.

Dr. Paul  30:32  
Yep. And, and I mean, back when I was really in that position, because I wasn't always vaccine risk aware, I was pretty good at it. You know, you, you have your lovely interaction. And those most of us in pediatrics, love kids, we love parents, we connect. And then right at the end of the visit, hand on the door, well, it's time for Johnny's shots. It's so great to see you. I'll see you again in a couple months, and we're out. And that I have questions now we avoid those questions. And the nurse comes in with a shot. Well, it's time for Johnny shot and blah, blah, blah, and it happens for five shots. That way, yeah. It's not one. Oh, my goodness. The other problem, though, with a parallel system that I see is the medical boards. So you may have heard my story, you know, they've been after me incessantly for the last four years, and I will be, I will be losing my license, it's just part of the only way I could survive was to actually eventually relinquish it. A lot of my peers have told me, they can't risk losing their license. Now I'm, I'm retirement age. So okay, I can risk it.

Daniel P. Kraft  31:47  
I can feel for doctors who are in their 40s or 50s. Because most of them have not put away enough money to retire early. And most can't envision developing some kind of alternative career, whether it's within medicine, they are totally distinct from from medicine. But to me, it's I feel blessed that I have been retired for a while so that I don't have to worry about this, this concern, because, for me, I probably would have been as outspoken as you. And it's it's very difficult for me to imagine that I would have been recommending the vaccine for babies six months old, or telling telling mothers when they came into my office, pregnant. Oh, it's perfectly safe for you to give the dog to take the to take the vaccine because there's no harm to the fetus. Yeah, based based on what? Something like 24 or 40. You know, rats, rat studies in France. Yeah. So I think that the safety studies, they're very suspect.

Dr. Paul  33:14  
Yeah. And we're seeing just devastating side effects everywhere. As people start, I like your question, asking people that you're trying to help them start thinking, you know, have you noticed any problems with health and people? You know, that's a good approach. Do you think it would work for our peers?

Daniel P. Kraft  33:32  
I think so. Because nowadays, I'm out, I think almost everybody has heard about one doctor or another, whether it's Canadian doctors, or we've heard about people who've had COVID problems, whether it's COVID that they themselves had. And I think it's a it's the foot in the door that we're able to ask them to examine the study the studies a little bit more carefully.

Dr. Paul  34:09  
I wonder how those of us, you know, my agent and on so you like you and I, who, who we had our golden years, so to speak, and things have gotten so difficult for our peers who are younger, to be able to really have open dialogue informed consent. So they have to either just become salesmen or rest their careers.

Daniel P. Kraft  34:39  
Radical in many cases, doctors are going to be superfluous because they're there. There are many doctors who don't even give all the vaccines in their office, they send them on to the health department or on to the pharmacy just to get them because it's, it's difficult to maintain an inventory without significant investment. And so I think that doctors are just going to be willing to say, go ahead, it's fine, it's fine to take the vaccine. So I, I think that it would be a very difficult position to be in.

Dr. Paul  35:18  
Yeah. Well, that just confirmed a thought I had actually, because I've seen that with the COVID. Especially, they rolled this out in every way possible, other than the doctors offices, right, we were the last to have access to getting the vaccine. And so they created these other mechanisms of distributing vaccines. And I see that happening more and more, which just as you said, doctors become irrelevant. As far as giving vaccines goes. So then the only thing we would be relevant for is informing our patients carefully and guiding them, which has always been traditionally our role, right to provide good information. Yet, if we take what's happened in California is sort of, here it goes, we're getting written out of that equation as well.

Daniel P. Kraft  36:09  
And they say what happens in California usually affects the rest of the country. So California is often at the, at the forefront of legislation, there are a lot of states who based their own their own legislation, on what they think is carefully careful wording on the part of the legislators. But as, as we know, with other people, in Maine, or in Texas, there have been many cases where doctors have been censured and have, I can't imagine having to fight the battle. And, and I can't imagine, I thought being sued for malpractice was bad, because that happened to me once. And that was really discouraging. And it was pretty expensive to, to hire my own lawyers to make sure that my interests were being protected. I just can't imagine what it must be like to have to, to defend yourself against. And also just the tarnishing of your reputation. Because I mean, there are going to be people who are just going to take it at face value, and they are going to say, Oh, they must have known something about Paul Thomas. Maybe it's not just the vaccine, maybe there's something shady about his reputation, even though you had no, no parents

Dr. Paul  37:34  
complaining at all. Not a single complaint. Right. But and yet, after they yanked my license, I've had 30 Plus letters from the board, just in the last two and a half years. Each requires multiple interactions with attorneys, you know, a incredible amount of effort, staff time to try to get what they want. There. It's It's unbelievable. So you mentioned at the beginning of the interview, you have kids and grandkids now who I think are fairly well vaccinated, even including the COVID jabs.

Daniel P. Kraft  38:10  
Yes. Yes. It scares me, scares me because I am a little bit worried about their health. And they've each promised May, that they're not going to do anymore. But and and as you can see, with the statistics, there's a very low compliance rate with the with the boosters, and in a certain population, and there's a very low acceptance of the early infant population, getting the initial series. So maybe there's hope that people are beginning to question what was once totally accepted? The trouble is that if they don't accept the COVID vaccine, maybe they're going to question all the vaccines, and then maybe there's going to be a rise in some of the other diseases that we've pretty much eliminated. Who knows, I mean, who knows how honest the studies are going to be or whether the studies will in fact, be be conducted? Yeah, there have been many opportunities during this pandemic for them to, to do studies on different things.

Dr. Paul  39:33  
It's always sad to me that when they introduce a new vaccine, and the COVID situation was just perfect for doing proper studies. So we started off with no one in the population that had ever had a COVID vaccine. So clearly, there was going to be a growing percentage of the population getting a shot and a diminishing group that was unvaccinated. But this that was the opportunity to Do the vaccine vac study for just looking at COVID. And look at all health outcomes because these, these vaccine safety studies usually cherry pick a few little outcomes and they look for a week or a month or a few months. I mean, even with this COVID, Pfizer trials, the control group was eliminated by allowing them to vaccinate.

Daniel P. Kraft  40:22  
But at the beginning of the vaccine rollout, they said that that type of study would be unethical, because they said that it would unfairly punish those who didn't get the vaccine because they were acting as if they knew the conclusions of the vaccine, that it was going to be totally successful and totally safe and totally effective.

Dr. Paul  40:44  
I think I read that there were 50 New mRNA vaccines in development. Yes. And the plan right now is fast tracking these vaccines. And if if they end up being as dangerous as what this COVID mRNA vaccine has been, I think we're in for a world of hurt for people who don't understand risk, and just without thinking next, except what they're being told, and roll up their sleeves to be basically part of the grand experiment.

Daniel P. Kraft  41:20  
I just this morning, I got a solicitation for a clinical trial. Not knowing that I was doctor but it was a clinical trial of the new flu vaccine based on the mRNA. Technology. Really, yes. It just came to me and I I said to my wife, boy, this is funny that I'm getting this speak. I don't even I'm not even going to respond to that one. Wow.

Dr. Paul  41:50  
That's so fascinating.

Daniel P. Kraft  41:52  
These things are definitely in the clinical trials. And they're going to think of vaccines as you know, the panacea for for everything that that could possibly ail us.

Dr. Paul  42:03  
Yeah. Well, I think, you know, there's clearly a financial interest in having your product be called a vaccine, because they're riding on the public awareness, or unawareness, that vaccines are safe and effective, which is that marketing slogan that I used to quote, I truly believed 20 years ago that vaccines were safe and effective. That's how I had been trained. You know, when we were salesmen for pharma in promoting vaccines. But when we amorphous into the mRNA technology, and then we can't even speak about it. And then you fast track it with no safety data, because that's already been approved. You don't have to do safety trials in humans anymore. Eight lab rats will do.

Daniel P. Kraft  42:49  
And if you're if you're in California, you're allowed just to tout the benefits without even explaining the possible risks.

Dr. Paul  42:56  
You Yeah, you can't or you will lose your license. I don't know where this is going. It's it's kind of a situation where medicine has been hijacked by monetary interests, at the very least. And perhaps there's even more sinister things behind it, I don't know. worries me a bit.

Daniel P. Kraft  43:20  
It's, it's very hard not to go down that track of fear that, that we no longer have real autonomy in, in what we what we recommend.

Dr. Paul  43:36  
So we're gonna close this out in the next few minutes, couple 234 minutes, and we're going to close on a positive note. And you just gave me the clue of where we're going here. I think we should encourage our audience, parents, grandparents, caregivers, no fear. So how do we move forward in faith without fear? And I'll pose that question to you first, and I have a couple of thoughts of my own.

Daniel P. Kraft  44:05  
It's the old question of once the toothpaste is out of the tube. So it's very hard once you've been alerted to the possible problems, and once people start hearing about possible problems, it's going to be very hard for people to pull back in their fear. I mean, there's nothing more fearful than then a new mother. I mean, all of us as pediatricians we've had to get good at being able to calm the fears of the anxious first parents. And if we ourselves as doctors are insecure about some of the advice that we're giving or are able to impart on our patients, I'm not exactly sure how we're going to be able to, to do this for this next generation. I I do feel sorry for For this next generation of, of families, kids and parents, so please give me something to be optimistic about.

Dr. Paul  45:11  
Okay, so I'm going to propose this. You Dr. Dan did not get the COVID shot, and you have not been fearful Is that correct? True. You did that because of your knowledge, background and understanding of risks and benefits. And you did your own scientific search and you realize, you know, there's not that much to be afraid of, I'm more afraid of the vaccine actually than I am.

Daniel P. Kraft  45:39  
You know, the disease. However, what do you tell parents? Who, if they can't get their kids in registered for school, because they haven't had the childhood vaccines? What do you tell them? You can't tell everybody to homeschool their kids? It's not feasible for for many families.

Dr. Paul  45:58  
Yeah, you're spot on a huge challenge. So back when I was a young parent, and and a doctor, a young doctor, I ended up raising nine kids, six were adopted, I could not have homeschooled. And my wife was not, didn't have that skill set. There was just no way she was a nurse and preferred nursing than parenting. She was a good mom, I'm not trying to say that, but just that wasn't her thing to stay home and homeschool. So I understand what you're saying. However, here's what I might propose as as a word of hope for those of you listening. And, Dr. Dan, I think you you did this for yourself with regards to COVID that is we have a natural immune system. I mean, we're it's a God given innate immune system. I'm not saying all vaccines are worthless. Vaccines can boost immunity for sure. But you had a trust in your own natural immune system that it would get you through this COVID SARS cov, two virus, the COVID epidemic pandemic, and it did your natural immune system and your supplements took care of you. And I would propose that as we venture into a new world of more and more mRNA technology vaccines, I would trust my natural immune system, and I would do everything possible to boost it, protect natural immunity, not destroy it. And on the surviving possible future infections, you're probably going to be fine. And then I would also

Daniel P. Kraft  47:28  
I would also say vaccine

Dr. Paul  47:29  
statement,

Daniel P. Kraft  47:30  
I would also look for alternative ways of curing things. Yep. The answer for curing many things in medicine is not necessarily a prescription from your doctor, sometimes it's changing your lifestyle, or using better home remedies, or my favorite medicine, which used to be time. I used to say to my patients all the time, the best medicine is time. And you don't. I mean, it sounded as corny as anything when I would say that if I give you an antibiotic, it's going to take a week if I don't, it's going to take seven days. And so I love that. So there there are, there are too many things that we rushed to treat. And with time, we're going to be better off and it probably will be less risk less risky.

Dr. Paul  48:29  
Yep. So to just answer your you post a great question if you're a parent of a young child who's entering school or is in school and your state does not allow for a religious or philosophical exemption. And there's a few of those states, California, Mississippi, West Virginia, I believe Maine, I might have missed one. All the rest of the states there is a mechanism for you to get an exemption philosophical or religious and your kids can go to school, the schools won't tell you this, you just have to look it up, figure out the steps you have to take and take those steps. If you live in one of the states that does not allow that and they tell you well, you can get a medical exemption. Truth of the matter is you can't anymore doctors who write medical exemptions lose their licenses. It's as simple as that. So you're left with the option of moving to a state where you can get an exemption, or homeschooling like you said, and that's otherwise you have to take the vaccines they're telling you to take and if the risk of doing that gets to severe parents are in a real hot rock and a hard spot.

Daniel P. Kraft  49:36  
That's why I really hope that the COVID vaccine does not become part of the regimen of childhood vaccines. Yeah, you

Dr. Paul  49:45  
and me both. And if it does, folks, I'm just saying knowing what I know now I would do whatever it takes not to get that into my kids. I won't put it into my own body. Never,

Daniel P. Kraft  49:58  
ever period It sounds like you agree. I do.

Dr. Paul  50:05  
Well, let's end it on that unless you'd like to give a last word to the audience.

Daniel P. Kraft  50:11  
Thanks very much for having me on. And although i i like to end it on a on a happy note, I think that the happiest that I can be is just a very cautious note that people have to be very good consumers, they have to educate themselves. And they have to try to surround themselves with people who are willing to go out on a limb and give them the truth. Thank you for that.

Dr. Paul  50:43  
I would say, dig deep to get good information, because you're not going to get it from the mainstream news channels. You're not going to get it from the big social media platforms, they are all censoring big time. Have you experienced censorship, by the way?

Daniel P. Kraft  51:02  
Just by many friends who don't talk to us anymore? Yeah. Because they, they are either afraid that I'm gonna give them bad advice, you know, they know that I'm gonna recommend not getting vaccines, or they, they're afraid of hugging us. And, and it's actually them now that I'm a little bit afraid of hugging. But so that that, to me has been the personal censorship that I've, that I've suffered. But whenever, whenever I do give advice to my daughters, I have to dole it out carefully, because I don't want to scare them. But I, if I'm a little bit too emphatic about it. I think that many times they say, Oh, Dad, are you being antivax? Again?

Dr. Paul  52:02  
Oh, dear, you've gotten to the dark side. Yes. Right. Oh, my goodness. Well, Dan, thank you so much for being on against the wind. This has been a really enjoyable talk. And I hope our viewers got something they can take home and use. And let's do this again someday.

Bernadette Pajer  52:20  
Thank you. So can you update us on what's going on now with you

Dr. Paul  52:30  
many of you know that after writing my book, The vaccine friendly plan and publishing in 2016, that started bringing attention to myself. And the work I'm doing the research I do. And the Medical Board has just been pummeling me with. They're not really complaints. There aren't patient complaints. These are letters requesting things, and I have to provide it. I mean, in some cases, it's hundreds of details about patients and how to contact them. I mean, it's it's insane. I'm not allowed to share any details yet. But the time is coming when this genie is coming out of the bottle, folks, here's what's happened. January. So have you heard this story? January of 2021? Was it No 2020, January of 2020. The board said prove that the vaccine friendly plan was as safe as the CDC schedule. And I just thought, wow, how do you do that? Thankfully, somebody said, well just do a quality assurance study. See what you're finding in your practice? Oh, that's brilliant. hired an outside expert, we got every data set for every visit every vaccine given only for the patients born into the practice. So it's a real representative sample, nobody was excluded. Every single baby born into my practice over 10 and a half years, that data was published November of that year 2020. And five days after it was available online, they took my license emergency suspension, you remember that? Since that suspension, I've had over 3033, zero communications requesting stuff. I mean, they just keep hammering. So they're building the stack of things. And they kept postponing the date of when I could have my hearing. Every legal expert I've consulted has said Paul in Oregon, and many other states, not all but most states. The way they handle physician complaints with these medical boards is a total kangaroo court. And here's what I'll explain how it works here in Oregon. So I had a three week trial set for November of this year. And their side will bring in experts from around the country, CDC experts, infectious disease experts, the pediatric head of this that and the other all working for captured agencies, and they will just pile on a heap of pro vaccine stuff. And then all these complaints well they're not complaints these concerns they have that are are completely bogus, honestly, I mean, yeah, if you've read the book, The War on informed consent, that was before they put the gag order on me, so at least we got some of the how ridiculous it was, yeah, they were gonna run up some quarter half million dollar worth of fees and fines and I have to pay for their legal attorneys. How it works in these courts, you you are only appearing in front of a Oregon appointed judge who actually works for the state, as does the board. And even if that Judge were to find me completely innocent of all, quote charges, the board can still do what it wants, and they will find fault, because then I get to pay for all their attorney fees and their fines, et cetera, et cetera. So legal advice of PA, this is a complete no win situation. And they orchestrated a settlement. And so that has not been completed as of the time of interviewing this interview. So I cannot give you those details until that the ink is dry. But probably in December, I will no longer be licensed in Oregon, my license in Washington will probably fall like a domino. And then I don't know what's gonna happen with the Hawaii but I suspect it may fall as well. I am continuing so many of you heard on high wire recently, I have filed a lawsuit against the board that's in civil court. And all the attorneys say if you're in civil court, hands down, you win this, because we have so much evidence of you know, wrongdoing on their part and just, you know, really illegal activities. So hopefully, we will get past their absolute immunity matter. Our boards claim absolute immunity, because they're doing the work of the state. And so apparently, you can do illegal things and be immune. But I think we'll have a case both on freedom of speech and a bunch of various issues that are outlined on high wire. So that's the update.

Bernadette Pajer  57:04  
Wow. I'm so sorry to hear that your patients are going to lose you. And but I so admire you for continuing on this good fight, you are going to go in the history books, whether you wanted to take this role or not. Here you are leading the way. I hope somebody's listening in the state of Oregon, and activists who understands how to draft and file bills, we'll get some good Bill's going to reform the Oregon Medical Board as it is established under Oregon law so that these sorts of things can't happen again, we need to fix that system. And you know, I would I hope your civil suit does challenge their notion that they can get away with with basically murders what they're doing. And they should not be allowed to do that. A lot of times you're covered for innocent things, but not for willful fraud, attack, that sort of thing. So our prayers and energy are absolutely with you, Dr. Paul, and we're going to create a whole new paradigm. So I know that as a as a healer, you will recreate yourself under some new system where you can once again give fully informed consent to the parents in your young patients that I see that for you.

Dr. Paul  58:31  
Yeah, well, they can't take away my MD. My they can't take away my knowledge, they can't take away my training. And I will stay in this because this is all about the kids. There's going to be a new program kids first forever that I'm going to be putting together and so I can continue this work and this show folks against the wind. Doctors in science under fire, we may pivot to with the wind because let me tell you, the wind is changing. Some of us are dropping in that sense that we're losing our licenses and things like that. But the truth is get is starting to come out. And and so share this show put people in touch with the real information. And we got to get people off the regular news, the mainstream stuff. It's so censored that most people are completely blinded by propaganda. It's basically just that so shows like this shows like yours burned down and informed life radio. I know you you are doing amazing work. Thank you for exposing everything that you did today. And for Yeah, giving me a chance to say hi to the folks in the more personal way. Folks just support the show. Become a member if you can. That's a really great way to support and we will see you again next week. Thank you Dr. Paul.

Dr. Paul, thanks for watching the show. Please visit doctors and science.com there you can now access our members only section. This show is member supported. We don't have to take sponsors. We don't have to have anybody controlling the content of our show. This is a huge perk most people aren't aware of your membership gives you access to my eBooks, transcripts of every show, PowerPoints from talks I'm giving around the country and live bonus peeks at behind the scenes work. We're doing my off the cuff thoughts and reviews on current events. Your support makes all this possible. Thank you. Help me spread the truth and share this on social media and with your friends at doctors and science.com. I look forward to running with you against the wind. Go to our website doctors and science.com Sign up. Donate if you can. And let's make this the weekly show the nation has been waiting for. I'm Dr. Paul

Transcribed by https://otter.ai