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With the Wind with Dr. Paul – Show 196: Pediatric Perspectives: Costly Mistakes: Kids and COVID with Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
Speakers’ Speaking Times
Dr. Paul
00:00:40:34 – 00:01:05:39
VAX facts this book hits bookstores December 10th. You can get a copy now by going to VAX Facts book.com, where you can get a signed author's copy, where you can order an e-book, or you can also preorder the book if you are seeing this message before December 10th. You can also order this book at any bookseller, any bookstore, wherever books are sold, and preorder your copy.
Dr. Paul
00:01:05:53 – 00:01:17:28
Get this book for your loved ones, for your family, for yourself, and let’s get healthy.
Dr. Paul
00:01:35:16 – 00:01:52:13
Good morning and welcome from wherever you’re tuning in from around the world. Welcome to Pediatric Perspectives. This is where we are looking at children’s health challenges from a different perspective, one that includes critical thinking. I am honored to have back my guest today, Doctor Liz Mumford.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:01:52:24 – 00:01:54:49
Thanks for having me on, Paul.
Dr. Paul
00:01:54:53 – 00:02:16:26
Liz is one of my mentors. And, as a pediatrician of 45 years and still going strong. You’re an educator. I met you first when you were, one of the teachers and instructors at den to Feed Autism Now. And you are still teaching maps, which is medical academy and pediatric special needs. In fact, you’re just back from Australia, right?
Dr. Paul
00:02:16:26 – 00:02:20:17
Where you all put on a massive conference there.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:02:20:22 – 00:02:47:56
Yeah, I really love doing medical education and I love to travel. The Australians are wonderful. We wanted to go global with maps, and we feel like there is a worldwide need. And the Australian clinicians are so smart and so open to what we were teaching. So we had a fabulous time there, about 130 docs there. And it was wonderful.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:02:48:01 – 00:02:50:05
And I’m just now getting over my jetlag.
Dr. Paul
00:02:50:06 – 00:03:14:09
So that’s a long, long trip. I have not done it, but I’ve looked at how many hours it is, like, wow, this show today, folks, we are going to focus on something you’ve rarely heard about in the last few years, something called Covid. And the reason is that shot is still on the childhood immunization schedule, and pediatricians around the country are still giving it and really pushing it on.
Dr. Paul
00:03:14:09 – 00:03:34:37
Babies as young as six months of age. So, you just authored a new book, which I couldn’t put down. I just read it from cover to cover. Every single word. Kids and Covid costly mistakes that must never happen again. So I really want to delve into this a little bit. You know, in pediatrics, I was in practice when Covid hit and we just didn’t see much.
Dr. Paul
00:03:34:37 – 00:03:48:27
So how do you become an expert on Covid? Well, I want to find out because I know you did a really deep dive with connections worldwide. So how is it you became involved with Covid and why this book now?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:03:48:32 – 00:04:12:20
Well, when Covid first started, frankly, I was worried that maybe the babies would get really sick from it because babies tend to have small airways and they can get sick with certain respiratory illnesses. But I was very pleasantly surprised that in my practice, the babies that usually I found out that they had Covid because there was a sibling and I was testing who was positive.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:04:12:25 – 00:04:53:27
The babies tended to do great. They maybe had 1 or 2 days of a runny nose, or one of them had pinkeye for a day, but it didn’t seem to be really affecting them. And then the young children that I saw, it did not seem, any worse than a lot of their typical upper respiratory infections. So when I first heard that they were looking at this new mRNA technology and thinking of giving it to children, I immediately started thinking about the risks of an unproven technology versus, the benefits of of getting the vaccine, even if the vaccine prevented the illness.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:04:53:27 – 00:05:22:48
The illness wasn’t very bad in children. So to me, the risk profile would have to be absolutely stellar to even consider it. And I just felt like we didn’t have enough data. There were only about a thousand kids in each arm of the original trial. One of these girls actually got a very bad side effect, significant neurologic side effects that have her in a wheelchair now and using a feeding tube.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:05:22:53 – 00:06:00:52
And I thought that essentially a 1 in 1000 risk of a significant bad outcome far outweighed any potential benefit. So I just thought it was a bad idea from the beginning. And as I looked at the actual Pfizer clinical trials, which I read through and not necessarily every practicing physician would do that, I felt like they hadn’t really shown, significant benefit that would justify the new technology on on young and developing brain, as you say, babies down to six months of age.
Dr. Paul
00:06:01:02 – 00:06:18:59
You have the quote in your book and the reference to the, infection fatality rate for children. I mean, from birth from zero to age 19, it’s 0.001 to 0.003. What is that, like 1 in 1,000,000?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:06:19:04 – 00:06:44:44
Well, when they looked at children who died from Covid, there were a couple of different studies. And, one was 1 in 1,000,000 chance, the other was 1 in 2 point 5 million. But the crucial thing to understand is that those children had other illnesses, significant illnesses like leukemia or, very chronic and bad asthma. So they weren’t actually dying from Covid itself.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:06:44:49 – 00:07:13:03
It was more that they were already at risk with their health conditions, and Covid kind of tipped them over the edge. The other thing that was very confusing for the parents, I think, is that when the hospitals had a pediatric patient come in, even if it was for something like the car accident or a broken arm or a bike accident, they would test the children for Covid, and if they were positive, they would count them as having Covid.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:07:13:08 – 00:07:47:42
Now, many of these kids were totally asymptomatic, and when they actually looked critically at those patients, they felt like for most of them, the Covid issue wasn’t even really contributing to their hospitalization. But the hospitals were incentivized to, with money to be treating Covid patients. And so that’s why the counts were what they were. So it was really difficult, I think, for parents to navigate because, you know, the news, solid stories that are sensational.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:07:47:47 – 00:08:09:04
And the nurse wasn’t telling them, oh, relax. You know, your kids, if they get Covid, they’re probably going to be fine. You know, maybe you should give them some extra vitamin C or make sure that their vitamin D levels are good. Maybe you should, do just, you know, some old fashioned good sick care, like giving them lots of fluids.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:08:09:08 – 00:08:17:17
It was much more of a fear based kind of, messaging from mainstream media and from our government, frankly.
Dr. Paul
00:08:18:23 – 00:08:49:35
And you outlined in the book. So I think for parents, because parents, if you’re listening, you still may have to make this decision if you’re still plugged in with, you know, a regular typical pediatrician. I’ve heard and Liz, maybe you can comment on this, that pediatric practices are now required to carry the Covid vaccine. I lost my practice over the HPV vaccine and the rotavirus vaccine, which I thought neither of those had value, and a lot of things ended up with me losing my practice.
Dr. Paul
00:08:49:35 – 00:09:07:48
But, I think practices are being required to carry it and they’re going to be pushed to give this vaccine. So for parents, you need to weigh the risks and the benefits. As you studied and wrote in your book, what are some of the risks of this Covid jab?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:09:07:53 – 00:09:37:21
Well, sadly, I think that there are five different body areas that are really affected by this vaccine. The first that I talk about is the heart. So you may have heard that there are cases of either myocarditis or pericarditis. Myocarditis means an inflammation infection of the heart itself. And pericarditis is an inflammation, an infection of the sac that’s around the heart.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:09:37:26 – 00:10:02:22
And this is most prominent in adolescents and young men. So kids from the ages of about 16 up to 24. And then the American Committee of Immunization Practices looked at the myocarditis that they were seeing. They had the hope that it would be kind of a milder, gentler kind of myocarditis. They knew when they recommended it for children.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:10:02:22 – 00:10:32:51
And adolescents that there was about a 12 times increased likelihood that the child would get myocarditis or pericarditis if they got the shot, but they thought it wouldn’t be as severe as what we had seen in the past. So the heart concerns were one big area for me, and I did an extensive literature search to see that these reports were coming out very, very early after the so-called vaccines were rolled out to the public.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:10:32:56 – 00:11:04:49
A second area that we suspected very early on was that they would predispose people to autoimmunity and sadly, that is the case. One of our colleagues, Ari Lou Johnny, he’s an excellent immunologist, published a paper ahead of, the biggest pediatric rollout, suggesting that there are about 26 human tissues that would potentially cross react with the spike protein that these shots instructed the body to make.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:11:04:49 – 00:11:54:32
And he hypothesized, and sadly, it turned out to be right, that this would cause cross-reactive autoimmunity. So autoimmunity is when your body is making antibodies against its own tissues. So you’re essentially citing yourself, not a good situation and can be quite difficult to treat. Another area that I was concerned about had to do with reproduction, because women very early on were reporting changes in their periods that, you know, they went from having a normal 5 or 6 day period with the sort of right amount of bleeding to having longer periods with extra bleeding or their periods, instead of being once every 28 days all of a sudden or once every 20 days, or even.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:11:54:32 – 00:12:24:07
And this, I thought, was extraordinary. Women who were menopausal started bleeding. So I thought that there was just way too much that we didn’t understand about how these shots were impacting reproductive function and derailing this very exquisite and coordinated series of hormones that typically are working. Another area that’s very concerning to me for especially for young children, is the neurologic concerns.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:12:24:12 – 00:12:57:25
Pretty soon after the shots found out, we were noticing, cases of teen syndrome where it’s an ascending paralysis, where first your toes, Vietnam and your feet, and you lose the ability to walk. And as the paralysis marches up, sometimes it affects the diaphragm and interferes with breathing. We saw, people that had blood clots and strokes or hemorrhagic strokes where, they were bleeding too much with something called thrombocytopenia.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:12:57:30 – 00:13:29:44
The concerns about, interfering with the endothelium, which is the lining of the blood vessels, led very, sadly, to a lot of adverse neurologic outcomes. And then there were these small fiber neuropathies that were characterized by, tingling or burning sensations, or one patient described very eloquently that she felt like she was always being shot with electrical shots.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:13:29:49 – 00:13:58:01
And sadly, many of those patients were thought to be having anxiety or having panic attacks, and their symptoms were taking taken seriously by their doctors. But we now know that they truly had small fiber neuropathy. And then the last area, and fortunately in pediatrics we don’t see a lot of cancer. But after the shots rolled out, we started seeing cancer at younger ages.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:13:58:01 – 00:14:34:28
You may have heard that colon cancer, for example, which is 2% in the 50s or 60s, age groups, was now showing up in 20 and 30 year olds at a higher frequency. And furthermore, the cancers were presenting at an earlier stage. And one reason this might have happened is that we know that the Covid shots disabled something called p53, which is like the guardian of our genome, or that would protect our DNA from having mutations or changes that could lead to cancer.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:14:34:33 – 00:15:08:47
So I was worried about all five of those things. But we also started seeing increased deaths, increased all cause mortality in people that got the shots compared to those who didn’t, and an increase in disability in those who got the shots compared to those who didn’t. So overall, we had seen a great deal of pain and suffering, and I think not that much benefit to be had from these vaccines that, as you point out, are still being given.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:15:08:47 – 00:15:26:26
Every morning when I drive by my Walgreens, I see an ad to come in and get a Covid test or to schedule yourself for a free Covid shot. I’m so surprised that we’re still giving these shots so enthusiastically given research that I did, and what I uncovered.
Dr. Paul
00:15:26:31 – 00:15:52:08
Yeah, parents, anybody that is watching and listening, Doctor Mumford trains doctors. So if you got a little lost in that, let me just boil it down real simple. Covid isn’t going to harm your child. We know that. It’s not going to kill your child, period. It’s effectively zero risk of death. You’re going to probably get a high probability of myocarditis and death if you take the shot.
Dr. Paul
00:15:52:13 – 00:16:16:02
We’ve got the autoimmune conditions which are just exploding. I mean, Doctor Bumpers specializes in trying to treat that. And it’s very difficult to treat. And we could spend a whole session on just what’s causing that. And then we’ve got the infertility issues that are coming up. I mean, you’re injecting your baby with something that could potentially make them unable to have children for the rest of their lives.
Dr. Paul
00:16:16:15 – 00:16:40:13
Just one thing, not to mention bleeding problems and all of that kind of thing. Clot issues, neurologic issues, the cancer issues. This is ridiculous. When you put it on the scale, it’s like it’s all risk and no benefit, especially in children who don’t need it anyway. Just let them get Covid. For kids, it’s a common cold. Wow. Thank you for going through all that.
Dr. Paul
00:16:40:13 – 00:17:04:29
And your book actually is an easy read. So, I highly recommend everybody get kids and Covid just this is the final word as far as pediatrics in Covid. And I don’t know if this is still happening, but it sure happened a lot in the last few years. We were made guilty. If you’re a parent made to feel guilty if you weren’t getting your child immunized because your children are a danger to others, well.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:17:04:29 – 00:17:38:17
I do have a whole chapter about informed consent, which you and I feel very strongly about. We think that parents need to get true informed consent, and that did not happen during Covid. In fact, when bottles of Covid injections were ordered, the information sheet that you and I are used to seeing, Paul, it’s got very small print, but it was a huge piece of paper and what they did was they put an empty piece of paper in the Covid boxes.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:17:38:22 – 00:18:01:55
The, you know, folded up the same way. It didn’t have any information. And so here’s my question. How can I, as a doctor, give true informed consent if I don’t know what’s in the shots, if I don’t know what they report as the side effects, if I don’t know the mechanism of action, you know, typically all that information is in these handouts and we can read it and digest it.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:18:01:55 – 00:18:29:33
And then translate that for our patients. Yeah. But the other thing that never really came out is that, the as time went on, we saw that people who got Covid injections were actually much more likely to get Covid. There was a big Cleveland Clinic study just a couple of years into the pandemic that showed this. And many people who got the shots have gotten Covid 4 or 5 or six times.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:18:29:38 – 00:18:58:12
And the people that chose not to get the injections, but to get Covid naturally tend to have longer lasting and better immunity. So again, when you parents, when you’re looking at risk versus benefits, you are the biggest advocate for your child and you should not be bribed or coerced or humiliated into making a medical decision for your child.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:18:58:17 – 00:19:36:18
One of the things that I found most egregious about the Covid countermeasures, the way they played out, was this strategy of taking a bunch of elementary school kids and saying, kids, if everybody in this class gets a Covid injection, then you guys are going to have a pizza party or go to the skating rink, or go on a field trip that is bribery and coercion and that has no place in, medical care, and specifically the idea of manipulating elementary school kids through peer pressure.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:19:36:23 – 00:20:07:44
I just found that abhorrent. So, be strong. You know, nobody loves your child as much as you do. And sadly, there are, other motivations in play as new technology and new vaccine strategies come out that are not solely based on the benefit to the patient or the benefit to their child, there is money to be made, there are new technologies to explore.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:20:07:49 – 00:20:39:00
And I think that Covid should be looked at as kind of a gateway to the use of mRNA injections for numerous other purposes. And until some vaccine conferences where the vaccine developers are very excited about the fact that with, new viruses that come out, they could potentially have a mRNA vaccine in as little as 100 days if they can get the troublesome regulatory steps out of the way.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:20:39:05 – 00:21:03:05
And the regulatory steps are theoretically designed to protect your child from unforeseen side effects. So, take your role as a parent seriously. You are the decision maker. And, it does behoove you to really look at the benefits versus the risks for any medical interventions that you consent to.
Dr. Paul
00:21:03:10 – 00:21:27:30
Yeah, I’ve always said it’s sick people who get other sick. And as you pointed out, those who got the Covid shot. And this is still very true, are more likely to get Covid, so they are more likely to get someone else sick. So if you want to protect others, just get natural infection. Especially kids. Kids do just great with their what we call innate immune system.
Dr. Paul
00:21:27:30 – 00:21:39:37
Their natural inborn immune system is so great. Hindsight being what it is, we should have just let kids go to school with no masking, no social distancing. They all would have gotten natural immunity and would have been that shield of protection for the vulnerable.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:21:39:48 – 00:22:09:05
I think you’re right, Paul. And in fact, I have a whole chapter in the book about how it was so harmful to take kids away from their peer group, especially for adolescents, you know, adolescents, is a time when you really are finding your way and defining yourself by your relationships to your peers. And sadly, the suicide rate among teenagers started going up very early in the pandemic in February.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:22:09:05 – 00:22:45:34
And March, as the, you know, shutdowns were just being talked about. And that persisted throughout the summer and fall. And a lot of anxiety, depression, self-harming, increase in obsessive compulsive disorders, all that was seen as these countermeasures were taken. And it was a situation where, the risk of kids being together was vastly overstated and that was used for decision making by those that were in power.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:22:45:39 – 00:23:10:44
And, a lot of the people that were making those decisions were looking at it from an infectious disease standpoint and by their own admission, not really taking into account all the other social determinants of health, as what we call it, where one of the things that makes you really healthy is a great social network. And so for kids, that’s school, that’s their friends.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:23:10:49 – 00:23:39:39
And you don’t take that away from people without great consequences. So hindsight 2020. But there were many of us, even at the time, that were seeing that the kids did well with Covid and realizing the value of natural infection and the concerns over side effects of artificially induced, the immunity from these, injections, you notice I can’t really call them vaccines.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:23:39:39 – 00:23:55:31
They’re really not vaccines. They manipulate your genes to make the spike protein in the hopes that your immune system will see that and make just the right amount of a response. And that, sadly, has not turned out to be the case.
Dr. Paul
00:23:55:33 – 00:24:11:52
A lot of wishful thinking that you cover in the book very nicely. The changing definition of what a vaccine is, they are just we watering down the definition of a vaccine to the point where now it’s like anything that stimulates an immune response and doesn’t make any sense to me.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:24:11:52 – 00:24:37:43
One of the things that might have, been in play there was that if that product is a vaccine, it’s protected under the 1986 act that protects vaccine manufacturers from liability. So if they had called it gene therapy, they would have been liable if they had called it something else, a new medication, they would potentially be liable for damages.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:24:37:47 – 00:25:00:05
But if something is considered a vaccine, there’s, there’s some protection in the Prep act and protection in from the 1986 Childhood Vaccine Act that give the makers of those vaccines liability protection. So I suspect that was at least a part of the thinking there.
Dr. Paul
00:25:00:12 – 00:25:12:16
As we wrap it up, I’ve got two final lines of questioning for you. First, what advice would you give our new leaders? We have new leadership at HHS, NIH, CDC. What would you like them to think about?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:25:12:21 – 00:25:44:13
Well, the first thing is, I would really like them to look at the rise in all kinds of childhood chronic illness as a public health emergency. You and I have watched over the last two decades as asthma, allergies, asthma, autism, ADHD, diabetes, autoimmune diseases of other types have just increased exponentially. And that can’t be from bad genes.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:25:44:18 – 00:26:22:44
That has to be from some type of environmental influence on people’s genetic predispositions. So I think we need a very rapid, and deep dive into why that’s happening. And then I also would like the folks at HHS and FDA and NIH to realize that we have been using a protocol driven, algorithm driven model to identify a disease, call it the enemy, and then make new drugs to fight that disease.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:26:22:44 – 00:26:49:50
That’s very different from an approach where you promote health and you try to get people to be healthy through, good nutrition, good sleep patterns, lots of movement or exercise and developing these very important social networks. So promoting health, I think, needs to be at the top of the agenda, not just fighting disease with pharmaceuticals.
Dr. Paul
00:26:49:55 – 00:27:12:16
So well, but in fact, I’m going to have you back on to cover that whole topic of chronic disease. And how in our careers as pediatricians for decades, what we’ve seen. But your final thoughts here is for our audience, those who are listening to your regular moms and dads and aunts and uncles and grandparents, what advice do you give them moving forward?
Dr. Paul
00:27:12:21 – 00:27:14:49
From where we sit today?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:27:14:54 – 00:27:37:53
So I think that there are a lot of old fashioned remedies that really help modulate your child’s immune system, that we’ve lost sight of. One is, I actually really like for your kids to play in the dirt and to get licked by dogs because getting, exposure to those kinds of good germs is actually a way that their immune system learns not to overreact.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:27:37:53 – 00:28:23:24
I really want you to give your kids whole foods that are real foods. Not things that come in boxes that were processed in a factory. Our foods have this incredible mixture of vitamins and minerals and light and nutrients that help our cells on an individual basis, run well. I want you to get your kids outside. I want them to be barefoot in the wet grass and barefoot on the wet sand and, spending time outside where they get exposure to all of nature’s bounty and then really work on extended family relationships and having playdates with other kids.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:28:23:29 – 00:28:48:27
Because our social support and our social networks is one of the things that helps us thrive. And that needs to start when your child is young. So those are very basic things that you can really do to make your child less likely to have a chronic illness and more likely to handle the acute illnesses. The viruses that they’ll catch when they go to school.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:28:48:32 – 00:28:55:52
Very well. If you’ve got those things in place, it should just be a blip in their, timeline.
Dr. Paul
00:28:55:56 – 00:29:24:56
Fantastic. Well, I’m no longer licensed, so I don’t give medical advice, but I would add to it, having published my own book, VAX facts, that you should thoroughly investigate vaccines and perhaps pause until you really understand the risks and benefits, and do that analysis for yourself and I. And of course, especially with regards to Covid, Doctor Month for your new book is just a must read, and I really encourage everybody to get this book, kids and Covid.
Dr. Paul
00:29:25:01 – 00:29:42:27
It is really, really, really, really the answer. Once you’ve read that, you’ll you’ll know what to do. Knowledge is power. Thank you. Doctor will definitely have you back. And I imagine this book is available anywhere books are sold. Or is there a special place for people to go?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:29:42:32 – 00:29:54:26
Well, it is, available to preorder through either Children’s Health Defense website or from Amazon. It will actually start being shipped on May 20th, which is actually not that far away now.
Dr. Paul
00:29:54:34 – 00:29:58:30
Thanks again and I really appreciate you coming on the show.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:29:58:35 – 00:30:16:32
Listen, Paul, it’s always a pleasure to talk with you.
Speakers’ Speaking Times
- Dr. Paul — 25.2%
- Elizabeth Mumper, M.D. — 74.8%
Dr. Paul
00:00:40:34 – 00:01:05:39
VAX facts this book hits bookstores December 10th. You can get a copy now by going to VAX Facts book.com, where you can get a signed author's copy, where you can order an e-book, or you can also preorder the book if you are seeing this message before December 10th. You can also order this book at any bookseller, any bookstore, wherever books are sold, and preorder your copy.
Dr. Paul
00:01:05:53 – 00:01:17:28
Get this book for your loved ones, for your family, for yourself, and let’s get healthy.
Dr. Paul
00:01:35:16 – 00:01:52:13
Good morning and welcome from wherever you’re tuning in from around the world. Welcome to Pediatric Perspectives. This is where we are looking at children’s health challenges from a different perspective, one that includes critical thinking. I am honored to have back my guest today, Doctor Liz Mumford.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:01:52:24 – 00:01:54:49
Thanks for having me on, Paul.
Dr. Paul
00:01:54:53 – 00:02:16:26
Liz is one of my mentors. And, as a pediatrician of 45 years and still going strong. You’re an educator. I met you first when you were, one of the teachers and instructors at den to Feed Autism Now. And you are still teaching maps, which is medical academy and pediatric special needs. In fact, you’re just back from Australia, right?
Dr. Paul
00:02:16:26 – 00:02:20:17
Where you all put on a massive conference there.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:02:20:22 – 00:02:47:56
Yeah, I really love doing medical education and I love to travel. The Australians are wonderful. We wanted to go global with maps, and we feel like there is a worldwide need. And the Australian clinicians are so smart and so open to what we were teaching. So we had a fabulous time there, about 130 docs there. And it was wonderful.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:02:48:01 – 00:02:50:05
And I’m just now getting over my jetlag.
Dr. Paul
00:02:50:06 – 00:03:14:09
So that’s a long, long trip. I have not done it, but I’ve looked at how many hours it is, like, wow, this show today, folks, we are going to focus on something you’ve rarely heard about in the last few years, something called Covid. And the reason is that shot is still on the childhood immunization schedule, and pediatricians around the country are still giving it and really pushing it on.
Dr. Paul
00:03:14:09 – 00:03:34:37
Babies as young as six months of age. So, you just authored a new book, which I couldn’t put down. I just read it from cover to cover. Every single word. Kids and Covid costly mistakes that must never happen again. So I really want to delve into this a little bit. You know, in pediatrics, I was in practice when Covid hit and we just didn’t see much.
Dr. Paul
00:03:34:37 – 00:03:48:27
So how do you become an expert on Covid? Well, I want to find out because I know you did a really deep dive with connections worldwide. So how is it you became involved with Covid and why this book now?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:03:48:32 – 00:04:12:20
Well, when Covid first started, frankly, I was worried that maybe the babies would get really sick from it because babies tend to have small airways and they can get sick with certain respiratory illnesses. But I was very pleasantly surprised that in my practice, the babies that usually I found out that they had Covid because there was a sibling and I was testing who was positive.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:04:12:25 – 00:04:53:27
The babies tended to do great. They maybe had 1 or 2 days of a runny nose, or one of them had pinkeye for a day, but it didn’t seem to be really affecting them. And then the young children that I saw, it did not seem, any worse than a lot of their typical upper respiratory infections. So when I first heard that they were looking at this new mRNA technology and thinking of giving it to children, I immediately started thinking about the risks of an unproven technology versus, the benefits of of getting the vaccine, even if the vaccine prevented the illness.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:04:53:27 – 00:05:22:48
The illness wasn’t very bad in children. So to me, the risk profile would have to be absolutely stellar to even consider it. And I just felt like we didn’t have enough data. There were only about a thousand kids in each arm of the original trial. One of these girls actually got a very bad side effect, significant neurologic side effects that have her in a wheelchair now and using a feeding tube.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:05:22:53 – 00:06:00:52
And I thought that essentially a 1 in 1000 risk of a significant bad outcome far outweighed any potential benefit. So I just thought it was a bad idea from the beginning. And as I looked at the actual Pfizer clinical trials, which I read through and not necessarily every practicing physician would do that, I felt like they hadn’t really shown, significant benefit that would justify the new technology on on young and developing brain, as you say, babies down to six months of age.
Dr. Paul
00:06:01:02 – 00:06:18:59
You have the quote in your book and the reference to the, infection fatality rate for children. I mean, from birth from zero to age 19, it’s 0.001 to 0.003. What is that, like 1 in 1,000,000?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:06:19:04 – 00:06:44:44
Well, when they looked at children who died from Covid, there were a couple of different studies. And, one was 1 in 1,000,000 chance, the other was 1 in 2 point 5 million. But the crucial thing to understand is that those children had other illnesses, significant illnesses like leukemia or, very chronic and bad asthma. So they weren’t actually dying from Covid itself.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:06:44:49 – 00:07:13:03
It was more that they were already at risk with their health conditions, and Covid kind of tipped them over the edge. The other thing that was very confusing for the parents, I think, is that when the hospitals had a pediatric patient come in, even if it was for something like the car accident or a broken arm or a bike accident, they would test the children for Covid, and if they were positive, they would count them as having Covid.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:07:13:08 – 00:07:47:42
Now, many of these kids were totally asymptomatic, and when they actually looked critically at those patients, they felt like for most of them, the Covid issue wasn’t even really contributing to their hospitalization. But the hospitals were incentivized to, with money to be treating Covid patients. And so that’s why the counts were what they were. So it was really difficult, I think, for parents to navigate because, you know, the news, solid stories that are sensational.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:07:47:47 – 00:08:09:04
And the nurse wasn’t telling them, oh, relax. You know, your kids, if they get Covid, they’re probably going to be fine. You know, maybe you should give them some extra vitamin C or make sure that their vitamin D levels are good. Maybe you should, do just, you know, some old fashioned good sick care, like giving them lots of fluids.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:08:09:08 – 00:08:17:17
It was much more of a fear based kind of, messaging from mainstream media and from our government, frankly.
Dr. Paul
00:08:18:23 – 00:08:49:35
And you outlined in the book. So I think for parents, because parents, if you’re listening, you still may have to make this decision if you’re still plugged in with, you know, a regular typical pediatrician. I’ve heard and Liz, maybe you can comment on this, that pediatric practices are now required to carry the Covid vaccine. I lost my practice over the HPV vaccine and the rotavirus vaccine, which I thought neither of those had value, and a lot of things ended up with me losing my practice.
Dr. Paul
00:08:49:35 – 00:09:07:48
But, I think practices are being required to carry it and they’re going to be pushed to give this vaccine. So for parents, you need to weigh the risks and the benefits. As you studied and wrote in your book, what are some of the risks of this Covid jab?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:09:07:53 – 00:09:37:21
Well, sadly, I think that there are five different body areas that are really affected by this vaccine. The first that I talk about is the heart. So you may have heard that there are cases of either myocarditis or pericarditis. Myocarditis means an inflammation infection of the heart itself. And pericarditis is an inflammation, an infection of the sac that’s around the heart.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:09:37:26 – 00:10:02:22
And this is most prominent in adolescents and young men. So kids from the ages of about 16 up to 24. And then the American Committee of Immunization Practices looked at the myocarditis that they were seeing. They had the hope that it would be kind of a milder, gentler kind of myocarditis. They knew when they recommended it for children.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:10:02:22 – 00:10:32:51
And adolescents that there was about a 12 times increased likelihood that the child would get myocarditis or pericarditis if they got the shot, but they thought it wouldn’t be as severe as what we had seen in the past. So the heart concerns were one big area for me, and I did an extensive literature search to see that these reports were coming out very, very early after the so-called vaccines were rolled out to the public.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:10:32:56 – 00:11:04:49
A second area that we suspected very early on was that they would predispose people to autoimmunity and sadly, that is the case. One of our colleagues, Ari Lou Johnny, he’s an excellent immunologist, published a paper ahead of, the biggest pediatric rollout, suggesting that there are about 26 human tissues that would potentially cross react with the spike protein that these shots instructed the body to make.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:11:04:49 – 00:11:54:32
And he hypothesized, and sadly, it turned out to be right, that this would cause cross-reactive autoimmunity. So autoimmunity is when your body is making antibodies against its own tissues. So you’re essentially citing yourself, not a good situation and can be quite difficult to treat. Another area that I was concerned about had to do with reproduction, because women very early on were reporting changes in their periods that, you know, they went from having a normal 5 or 6 day period with the sort of right amount of bleeding to having longer periods with extra bleeding or their periods, instead of being once every 28 days all of a sudden or once every 20 days, or even.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:11:54:32 – 00:12:24:07
And this, I thought, was extraordinary. Women who were menopausal started bleeding. So I thought that there was just way too much that we didn’t understand about how these shots were impacting reproductive function and derailing this very exquisite and coordinated series of hormones that typically are working. Another area that’s very concerning to me for especially for young children, is the neurologic concerns.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:12:24:12 – 00:12:57:25
Pretty soon after the shots found out, we were noticing, cases of teen syndrome where it’s an ascending paralysis, where first your toes, Vietnam and your feet, and you lose the ability to walk. And as the paralysis marches up, sometimes it affects the diaphragm and interferes with breathing. We saw, people that had blood clots and strokes or hemorrhagic strokes where, they were bleeding too much with something called thrombocytopenia.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:12:57:30 – 00:13:29:44
The concerns about, interfering with the endothelium, which is the lining of the blood vessels, led very, sadly, to a lot of adverse neurologic outcomes. And then there were these small fiber neuropathies that were characterized by, tingling or burning sensations, or one patient described very eloquently that she felt like she was always being shot with electrical shots.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:13:29:49 – 00:13:58:01
And sadly, many of those patients were thought to be having anxiety or having panic attacks, and their symptoms were taking taken seriously by their doctors. But we now know that they truly had small fiber neuropathy. And then the last area, and fortunately in pediatrics we don’t see a lot of cancer. But after the shots rolled out, we started seeing cancer at younger ages.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:13:58:01 – 00:14:34:28
You may have heard that colon cancer, for example, which is 2% in the 50s or 60s, age groups, was now showing up in 20 and 30 year olds at a higher frequency. And furthermore, the cancers were presenting at an earlier stage. And one reason this might have happened is that we know that the Covid shots disabled something called p53, which is like the guardian of our genome, or that would protect our DNA from having mutations or changes that could lead to cancer.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:14:34:33 – 00:15:08:47
So I was worried about all five of those things. But we also started seeing increased deaths, increased all cause mortality in people that got the shots compared to those who didn’t, and an increase in disability in those who got the shots compared to those who didn’t. So overall, we had seen a great deal of pain and suffering, and I think not that much benefit to be had from these vaccines that, as you point out, are still being given.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:15:08:47 – 00:15:26:26
Every morning when I drive by my Walgreens, I see an ad to come in and get a Covid test or to schedule yourself for a free Covid shot. I’m so surprised that we’re still giving these shots so enthusiastically given research that I did, and what I uncovered.
Dr. Paul
00:15:26:31 – 00:15:52:08
Yeah, parents, anybody that is watching and listening, Doctor Mumford trains doctors. So if you got a little lost in that, let me just boil it down real simple. Covid isn’t going to harm your child. We know that. It’s not going to kill your child, period. It’s effectively zero risk of death. You’re going to probably get a high probability of myocarditis and death if you take the shot.
Dr. Paul
00:15:52:13 – 00:16:16:02
We’ve got the autoimmune conditions which are just exploding. I mean, Doctor Bumpers specializes in trying to treat that. And it’s very difficult to treat. And we could spend a whole session on just what’s causing that. And then we’ve got the infertility issues that are coming up. I mean, you’re injecting your baby with something that could potentially make them unable to have children for the rest of their lives.
Dr. Paul
00:16:16:15 – 00:16:40:13
Just one thing, not to mention bleeding problems and all of that kind of thing. Clot issues, neurologic issues, the cancer issues. This is ridiculous. When you put it on the scale, it’s like it’s all risk and no benefit, especially in children who don’t need it anyway. Just let them get Covid. For kids, it’s a common cold. Wow. Thank you for going through all that.
Dr. Paul
00:16:40:13 – 00:17:04:29
And your book actually is an easy read. So, I highly recommend everybody get kids and Covid just this is the final word as far as pediatrics in Covid. And I don’t know if this is still happening, but it sure happened a lot in the last few years. We were made guilty. If you’re a parent made to feel guilty if you weren’t getting your child immunized because your children are a danger to others, well.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:17:04:29 – 00:17:38:17
I do have a whole chapter about informed consent, which you and I feel very strongly about. We think that parents need to get true informed consent, and that did not happen during Covid. In fact, when bottles of Covid injections were ordered, the information sheet that you and I are used to seeing, Paul, it’s got very small print, but it was a huge piece of paper and what they did was they put an empty piece of paper in the Covid boxes.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:17:38:22 – 00:18:01:55
The, you know, folded up the same way. It didn’t have any information. And so here’s my question. How can I, as a doctor, give true informed consent if I don’t know what’s in the shots, if I don’t know what they report as the side effects, if I don’t know the mechanism of action, you know, typically all that information is in these handouts and we can read it and digest it.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:18:01:55 – 00:18:29:33
And then translate that for our patients. Yeah. But the other thing that never really came out is that, the as time went on, we saw that people who got Covid injections were actually much more likely to get Covid. There was a big Cleveland Clinic study just a couple of years into the pandemic that showed this. And many people who got the shots have gotten Covid 4 or 5 or six times.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:18:29:38 – 00:18:58:12
And the people that chose not to get the injections, but to get Covid naturally tend to have longer lasting and better immunity. So again, when you parents, when you’re looking at risk versus benefits, you are the biggest advocate for your child and you should not be bribed or coerced or humiliated into making a medical decision for your child.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:18:58:17 – 00:19:36:18
One of the things that I found most egregious about the Covid countermeasures, the way they played out, was this strategy of taking a bunch of elementary school kids and saying, kids, if everybody in this class gets a Covid injection, then you guys are going to have a pizza party or go to the skating rink, or go on a field trip that is bribery and coercion and that has no place in, medical care, and specifically the idea of manipulating elementary school kids through peer pressure.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:19:36:23 – 00:20:07:44
I just found that abhorrent. So, be strong. You know, nobody loves your child as much as you do. And sadly, there are, other motivations in play as new technology and new vaccine strategies come out that are not solely based on the benefit to the patient or the benefit to their child, there is money to be made, there are new technologies to explore.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:20:07:49 – 00:20:39:00
And I think that Covid should be looked at as kind of a gateway to the use of mRNA injections for numerous other purposes. And until some vaccine conferences where the vaccine developers are very excited about the fact that with, new viruses that come out, they could potentially have a mRNA vaccine in as little as 100 days if they can get the troublesome regulatory steps out of the way.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:20:39:05 – 00:21:03:05
And the regulatory steps are theoretically designed to protect your child from unforeseen side effects. So, take your role as a parent seriously. You are the decision maker. And, it does behoove you to really look at the benefits versus the risks for any medical interventions that you consent to.
Dr. Paul
00:21:03:10 – 00:21:27:30
Yeah, I’ve always said it’s sick people who get other sick. And as you pointed out, those who got the Covid shot. And this is still very true, are more likely to get Covid, so they are more likely to get someone else sick. So if you want to protect others, just get natural infection. Especially kids. Kids do just great with their what we call innate immune system.
Dr. Paul
00:21:27:30 – 00:21:39:37
Their natural inborn immune system is so great. Hindsight being what it is, we should have just let kids go to school with no masking, no social distancing. They all would have gotten natural immunity and would have been that shield of protection for the vulnerable.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:21:39:48 – 00:22:09:05
I think you’re right, Paul. And in fact, I have a whole chapter in the book about how it was so harmful to take kids away from their peer group, especially for adolescents, you know, adolescents, is a time when you really are finding your way and defining yourself by your relationships to your peers. And sadly, the suicide rate among teenagers started going up very early in the pandemic in February.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:22:09:05 – 00:22:45:34
And March, as the, you know, shutdowns were just being talked about. And that persisted throughout the summer and fall. And a lot of anxiety, depression, self-harming, increase in obsessive compulsive disorders, all that was seen as these countermeasures were taken. And it was a situation where, the risk of kids being together was vastly overstated and that was used for decision making by those that were in power.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:22:45:39 – 00:23:10:44
And, a lot of the people that were making those decisions were looking at it from an infectious disease standpoint and by their own admission, not really taking into account all the other social determinants of health, as what we call it, where one of the things that makes you really healthy is a great social network. And so for kids, that’s school, that’s their friends.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:23:10:49 – 00:23:39:39
And you don’t take that away from people without great consequences. So hindsight 2020. But there were many of us, even at the time, that were seeing that the kids did well with Covid and realizing the value of natural infection and the concerns over side effects of artificially induced, the immunity from these, injections, you notice I can’t really call them vaccines.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:23:39:39 – 00:23:55:31
They’re really not vaccines. They manipulate your genes to make the spike protein in the hopes that your immune system will see that and make just the right amount of a response. And that, sadly, has not turned out to be the case.
Dr. Paul
00:23:55:33 – 00:24:11:52
A lot of wishful thinking that you cover in the book very nicely. The changing definition of what a vaccine is, they are just we watering down the definition of a vaccine to the point where now it’s like anything that stimulates an immune response and doesn’t make any sense to me.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:24:11:52 – 00:24:37:43
One of the things that might have, been in play there was that if that product is a vaccine, it’s protected under the 1986 act that protects vaccine manufacturers from liability. So if they had called it gene therapy, they would have been liable if they had called it something else, a new medication, they would potentially be liable for damages.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:24:37:47 – 00:25:00:05
But if something is considered a vaccine, there’s, there’s some protection in the Prep act and protection in from the 1986 Childhood Vaccine Act that give the makers of those vaccines liability protection. So I suspect that was at least a part of the thinking there.
Dr. Paul
00:25:00:12 – 00:25:12:16
As we wrap it up, I’ve got two final lines of questioning for you. First, what advice would you give our new leaders? We have new leadership at HHS, NIH, CDC. What would you like them to think about?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:25:12:21 – 00:25:44:13
Well, the first thing is, I would really like them to look at the rise in all kinds of childhood chronic illness as a public health emergency. You and I have watched over the last two decades as asthma, allergies, asthma, autism, ADHD, diabetes, autoimmune diseases of other types have just increased exponentially. And that can’t be from bad genes.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:25:44:18 – 00:26:22:44
That has to be from some type of environmental influence on people’s genetic predispositions. So I think we need a very rapid, and deep dive into why that’s happening. And then I also would like the folks at HHS and FDA and NIH to realize that we have been using a protocol driven, algorithm driven model to identify a disease, call it the enemy, and then make new drugs to fight that disease.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:26:22:44 – 00:26:49:50
That’s very different from an approach where you promote health and you try to get people to be healthy through, good nutrition, good sleep patterns, lots of movement or exercise and developing these very important social networks. So promoting health, I think, needs to be at the top of the agenda, not just fighting disease with pharmaceuticals.
Dr. Paul
00:26:49:55 – 00:27:12:16
So well, but in fact, I’m going to have you back on to cover that whole topic of chronic disease. And how in our careers as pediatricians for decades, what we’ve seen. But your final thoughts here is for our audience, those who are listening to your regular moms and dads and aunts and uncles and grandparents, what advice do you give them moving forward?
Dr. Paul
00:27:12:21 – 00:27:14:49
From where we sit today?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:27:14:54 – 00:27:37:53
So I think that there are a lot of old fashioned remedies that really help modulate your child’s immune system, that we’ve lost sight of. One is, I actually really like for your kids to play in the dirt and to get licked by dogs because getting, exposure to those kinds of good germs is actually a way that their immune system learns not to overreact.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:27:37:53 – 00:28:23:24
I really want you to give your kids whole foods that are real foods. Not things that come in boxes that were processed in a factory. Our foods have this incredible mixture of vitamins and minerals and light and nutrients that help our cells on an individual basis, run well. I want you to get your kids outside. I want them to be barefoot in the wet grass and barefoot on the wet sand and, spending time outside where they get exposure to all of nature’s bounty and then really work on extended family relationships and having playdates with other kids.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:28:23:29 – 00:28:48:27
Because our social support and our social networks is one of the things that helps us thrive. And that needs to start when your child is young. So those are very basic things that you can really do to make your child less likely to have a chronic illness and more likely to handle the acute illnesses. The viruses that they’ll catch when they go to school.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:28:48:32 – 00:28:55:52
Very well. If you’ve got those things in place, it should just be a blip in their, timeline.
Dr. Paul
00:28:55:56 – 00:29:24:56
Fantastic. Well, I’m no longer licensed, so I don’t give medical advice, but I would add to it, having published my own book, VAX facts, that you should thoroughly investigate vaccines and perhaps pause until you really understand the risks and benefits, and do that analysis for yourself and I. And of course, especially with regards to Covid, Doctor Month for your new book is just a must read, and I really encourage everybody to get this book, kids and Covid.
Dr. Paul
00:29:25:01 – 00:29:42:27
It is really, really, really, really the answer. Once you’ve read that, you’ll you’ll know what to do. Knowledge is power. Thank you. Doctor will definitely have you back. And I imagine this book is available anywhere books are sold. Or is there a special place for people to go?
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:29:42:32 – 00:29:54:26
Well, it is, available to preorder through either Children’s Health Defense website or from Amazon. It will actually start being shipped on May 20th, which is actually not that far away now.
Dr. Paul
00:29:54:34 – 00:29:58:30
Thanks again and I really appreciate you coming on the show.
Elizabeth Mumper, M.D.
00:29:58:35 – 00:30:16:32
Listen, Paul, it’s always a pleasure to talk with you.
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