With the Wind with Dr. Paul – Show 187: Pediatric Perspectives: Measles Without Fear with Lawrence Palevsky, M.D.

A critical look at measles, vaccines, and truth beyond fear

​In this episode of With the Wind: SCIENCE Revealed, Dr. Paul Thomas welcomes back pediatrician Dr. Lawrence Palevsky for a powerful conversation on measles. Together, they explore history, natural immunity, and the fear-based messaging that dominates public health today. This discussion challenges assumptions and encourages parents to think critically about how we understand illness, vaccines, and healing.

Looking Back at Measles Before Vaccines
Dr. Palevsky recalls his own childhood experience with measles and reviews historical data. Mortality rates had already declined significantly before the measles vaccine was introduced in 1963. He emphasizes that the illness, when supported with nutrition, hydration, vitamins, and rest, was generally benign.

“Measles is not a deadly disease. With proper care, nutrition, hydration, and natural support, most kids just cruise through it.” — Lawrence Palevsky, M.D.

The Role of Fear
Dr. Paul and Dr. Palevsky agree that fear—not measles—is often the greatest threat. Measles was once considered a normal part of childhood, managed at home with confidence by families. Today, however, fear-based public health narratives often overshadow scientific nuance.

​Vaccine Limitations and Failures
The doctors address myths surrounding the measles vaccine. Dr. Palevsky explains that vaccination does not guarantee immunity—2–10% of children fail to produce antibodies, some develop non-protective antibodies, and even effective antibodies may fade within months. Dr. Paul adds that natural infection provides lifelong immunity, while vaccine-induced immunity wanes, increasing susceptibility to outbreaks as naturally immune generations pass on.

Risks of Shedding and Immunocompromised Families
Dr. Palevsky notes that the live measles virus in the MMR vaccine can remain in nasal passages for 30–100 days, raising concerns for immunocompromised individuals. Dr. Paul highlights that vaccinating a child in such households may actually increase risk of exposure for vulnerable family members.

The Texas Case: With Measles or From Measles?
They discuss the tragic death of a six-year-old from a Mennonite community in Texas. Dr. Palevsky stresses the difference between dying with measles and dying from measles, noting that full medical records are still under review. He points out that medical errors and misattribution of cause of death, seen also during COVID, can distort public perception.

​Clinical Care on the Ground
Dr. Paul references an article in Children’s Health Defense describing Dr. Ben Edwards’ care for over 70 patients with measles in Texas. Dr. Edwards used cod liver oil for vitamin A and supportive treatments like budesonide for respiratory support. Dr. Palevsky confirmed reports of children improving within 24 hours of vitamin A, while also noting an unusual prevalence of respiratory symptoms in these cases.

This episode of With the Wind offers clarity and reassurance in a time of fear and confusion. Dr. Paul and Dr. Palevsky remind us that measles, while serious in rare cases, is not the terrifying disease it is often portrayed to be. They call for honesty, historical perspective, and a renewed trust in natural immunity.

​For more episodes and resources, visit DoctorsAndScience.com and explore family support tools at Kids First 4Ever.

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Show Notes:

With the Wind with Dr. Paul – Show 187: Pediatric Perspectives: Measles Without Fear with Lawrence Palevsky, M.D.
Title: Measles Without Fear with Lawrence Palevsky, M.D.
Presenters: Dr. Paul, Lawrence Palevsky, M.D.
Length: Approximately 60 minutes


Web Resources Discussed

• Children’s Health Defense Defender article, March 5, 2025 (referenced in transcript)
• American Academy of Pediatrics statement on vitamin A and measles
• World Health Organization — guidance on vitamin A for measles (referenced)

Summary
Dr. Paul welcomes back his colleague and pediatrician Dr. Lawrence Palevsky for an in-depth discussion on measles, public health messaging, and vaccine concerns. Together, they explore the history of measles before and after the vaccine, the reality of immunity, and recent events in Texas involving a child’s tragic death. They emphasize the importance of context, critical thinking, and honest assessment of risks. This conversation challenges fear-driven narratives and offers insight into safe, natural approaches to childhood health.


Key Points (with time stamps)

• 00:00:40 – Dr. Paul’s Intro: Announcement of VAX FACTS book release and ordering details.
• 00:01:35 – Welcome: Dr. Paul introduces Pediatric Perspectives and guest Dr. Lawrence Palevsky.
• 00:02:08 – Dr. Palevsky Joins: Expresses enthusiasm for discussing measles.
• 00:02:42 – Setting the Stage: Dr. Paul outlines current fear-driven messaging about measles.
• 00:02:52 – Historical Perspective: Dr. Palevsky recalls childhood measles and data showing mortality rates had dropped before the 1963 vaccine.
• 00:03:55 – Natural Course of Illness: Dr. Palevsky describes measles as generally benign with good care, nutrition, hydration, and vitamins A, C, and D.
• 00:05:30 – Fear vs. Reality: Dr. Paul notes measles was not feared in his practice or childhood. He expresses greater concern about today’s exaggerated responses.
• 00:06:10 – Full Disclosure: Both doctors clarify they are sharing personal experiences, not medical advice.
• 00:06:53 – Vaccine Myths: Dr. Palevsky critiques misconceptions — that measles is absent without symptoms and that vaccines eliminate the virus.
• 00:07:59 – Waning Immunity: Dr. Paul emphasizes that natural infection gives lifelong protection, while vaccine immunity wanes.
• 00:08:50 – Vaccine Failure: Dr. Palevsky explains that 2–10% of children do not develop antibodies after MMR, others develop non-protective antibodies, and even protective antibodies may only last months.
• 00:10:51 – Propaganda and Fear: Notes that mothers and grandmothers once knew how to handle measles, but fear now dominates public perception.
• 00:11:28 – Shedding from Vaccine: Live virus from MMR can persist in nasal passages for 30–100 days, raising concerns for immunocompromised individuals.
• 00:12:17 – Immunocompromised Parents: Dr. Paul stresses that vaccinating a child in such households may expose vulnerable family members to live virus.
• 00:13:33 – Texas Case: Dr. Palevsky details the tragic death of a child from a Mennonite community, highlighting the difference between dying “with” measles vs. “from” measles, and the need for full medical record review.
• 00:17:34 – Treatment on the Ground: Dr. Paul references Dr. Ben Edwards’ work in Texas treating over 70 measles patients with vitamin A (cod liver oil) and supportive care.
• 00:18:46 – Clinical Outcomes: Dr. Palevsky reports that Edwards observed rapid improvement with vitamin A, though notes the unusual prevalence of respiratory symptoms in these cases.

Conclusion
This episode underscores the importance of informed, rational perspectives on measles, immunity, and vaccines. Dr. Paul and Dr. Palevsky highlight that while measles can be serious, fear-driven narratives often distort reality. By reflecting on history, clinical experiences, and current events, they provide a balanced view — reminding parents and practitioners alike to seek truth, context, and thoughtful care.


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